Designer 3.0 and Vector Grouping feature

[DickB]

Thanks for the update lynfrwd. I'm with brdad, I think this would be a great enhancement. mtylerfl, thanks for pointing out another way to do this, but it would be nice to not require DXF Importer. I will consider getting the DXF add-on. I hope LHR keeps having contests so I have a chance at winning more store credit!

[brdad]

I have Inkscape I use for other non-carving work on occasion. But for me I can't justify the DXF importer. Most items I trace I make a custom wood with the image I want and trace manually in designer. I'm sure it takes longer but I just don't sell enough projects and usually they are not overly complicated. And at that point I end up applying a fixed-depth vector to the lines or a depth profile. Hopefully vector groups will eliminate the need to do most of that.

Also, in the latter part of my example, I have had times when I've outlined a pattern (often someone else's so I do not have the original graphic) and want to alter it, or to repair those un-closed outlines so you can make a carve region out of it.

[mtylerfl]

I have Inkscape I use for other non-carving work on occasion. But for me I can't justify the DXF importer. Most items I trace I make a custom wood with the image I want and trace manually in designer. I'm sure it takes longer but I just don't sell enough projects and usually they are not overly complicated. And at that point I end up applying a fixed-depth vector to the lines or a depth profile. Hopefully vector groups will eliminate the need to do most of that.

Also, in the latter part of my example, I have had times when I've outlined a pattern (often someone else's so I do not have the original graphic) and want to alter it, or to repair those un-closed outlines so you can make a carve region out of it.

Sounds to me like you could benefit greatly and immediately with the DXF Importer. But, to each his own!

[SteveEJ]

Connie,
Were the engineers able to verify the issues I brought up? Do you know if they are on the list for fixes?

Thx,

[Capt Bruce]

Hi Bruce,

It won't carve with the regular 1/16" bit...that's not allowed for the v-carve function (can use the 60 or 90-degree only for now).

I would go ahead and carve it as usual, using the 60-degree you already assigned to the Vector Group.

I predict that there will be some areas of your design that will chip out, but even so, it may be acceptable. A test carve will tell. Let us know how you make out after you run it.

Thanks Michael,

I fully expect that it will carve completely with the assigned 60 degree V Bit not the 1/16" Carving bit. It was just curious to me that in looking at the close up detail view, that the bottoms of the "carved lines" look more like the bottom surface that would be left by a raster carving (rounded rather than sharp V). I hope I will find this is just a default of the rendering system rather than a true prediction of the carved output. Sometimes I worry too much about these processes, and instead I should walk down to the shop with the card and carve the darn thing. Paralysis through analysis.
Thanks again

[lynnfrwd]

Suggestions for Vector Group feature:

1 - have a way to change a Vector Group back to a normal path without having to use 'Undo'.
2 - Have a way to edit the properties of a Vector Group after you have pressed the 'OK' in the dialog box.
3 - Have a way to adjust the bit depth. I could not find this.
4 - Disable (ghost/gray out) in the drop down menus, any puffing, etc. after a vector group is established as these features are no longer available to these groups. I can select them now to a vector group and go to the requester where it is ghosted out but is should be done in the drop down menus and not be able to be selected in the first place.

Added: I just found that if I select a closed vector and hit the cutout button there is no 'Cancel' button on the dialog box. To get out you have to press 'Accept' then 'Undo' the operation. Is this normal? I just tested this with a Windows version and it does not have a 'Cancel' either but it DOES have a close dialog/window button in the upper right corner. If the Mac version had this same feature that would solve the issue.


Added-2: If I place a simple closed circle and make it a vector group it displays correctly. If I select that group and 'Delete' it the drawing line disappears but the carving on the board remains. If I do the same thing but instead assign a 90 degree V-Bit it shows the board with the carving. When I select and delete it the carving on the board goes away as it should.

I work with vectors a good bit and simulating chip carving is a great add-on. These changes are not suggested to be critical but to help with the software. If I am missing something please let me know.

Thanks,

I will bring this to their attention and ask.

[brdad]

Sounds to me like you could benefit greatly and immediately with the DXF Importer. But, to each his own!

I don't want to hijack this thread, but how do you end up with a single trace line using Inkscape trace bitmap / DXF Importer? I just played with both using the demo for DXF as well as looked at several videos and it would appear I'd have to manually create my own single traces anyway as the trace bitmap function merely traces the outline of the lines of a line drawing. I can see where it might help if I want those outlines to make carve regions and it should work fine with the new vector groups, but I don't see it making a single trace suitable for making a centerline-ish vector cut. Example below is a current project - generally my original artwork is better quality, but this was the customer's artwork from a PDF. I used my custom woods method and manually traced for this and would guess it took a bit less than 10 minutes to trace.

[Ton80]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but how do you end up with a single trace line using Inkscape trace bitmap / DXF Importer? I just played with both using the demo for DXF as well as looked at several videos and it would appear I'd have to manually create my own single traces anyway as the trace bitmap function merely traces the outline of the lines of a line drawing. I can see where it might help if I want those outlines to make carve regions and it should work fine with the new vector groups, but I don't see it making a single trace suitable for making a centerline-ish vector cut. Example below is a current project - generally my original artwork is better quality, but this was the customer's artwork from a PDF. I used my custom woods method and manually traced for this and would guess it took a bit less than 10 minutes to trace.

Just to jump back a few days, you mentioned you weren't able to get the same results I was using the ScanFont software... if you tried to feed it the pdf image your customer sent you that would be part of the problem. I always import such artwork to inkscape and vectorize it before exporting back to raster format ( PNG ) and letting ScanFont do it's thing. That way you have a very clean image with no artifacts or pixelations, which will cause problems. Even the folks at FontLabs were surprised at the amount of detail I am able to get into those font glyphs... not sure why because I'm only using their software and I don't have any special tricks that I incorporate.

I'm going to have play with the 3.0 demo/DXF demo a bit because I am really not sure whether it's a better answer for my work... I've gotten pretty good at using font software to import my images and a $500 investment that might not work with the vector images I currently have on file is a big concern.

Maybe I am wrong but maybe the 2d drawing tool package is a better investment for you than the DXF import is. Since it sounds like the 2d drawing package combined with Designer 3.0 will allow you to trace your images directly within Designer and then create a vector group. Sounds like that is much closer to your current process than using inkscape/DXF is.

[SteveEJ]

Connie.. This is what I verified and wanted to bring to their attention:

"For the Designer programmers:

1 - I have verified that on the Windows version of Designer the option "Make Vector Group" works correctly from the 'Tools' Menu, Carving list right click and the 'Utility' tool bar button. Once the Vector Group is made, it still works from all three options. It DOES NOT work that way on the Mac version. After the Vector Group is established it ONLY WORKS from the carve list. The Toolbar button and the Tools menu items are disabled.

2 - The Cut Path dialog box in Windows contains the standard Windows Close/minimize/maximize buttons, the Mac version does not have these options in its dialog box. The only way out for a Mac is to accept and undo where as for Windows users can select the close window button to exit.

Hope this helps."

I will bring this to their attention and ask.

[mtylerfl]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but how do you end up with a single trace line using Inkscape trace bitmap / DXF Importer? I just played with both using the demo for DXF as well as looked at several videos and it would appear I'd have to manually create my own single traces anyway as the trace bitmap function merely traces the outline of the lines of a line drawing. I can see where it might help if I want those outlines to make carve regions and it should work fine with the new vector groups, but I don't see it making a single trace suitable for making a centerline-ish vector cut. Example below is a current project - generally my original artwork is better quality, but this was the customer's artwork from a PDF. I used my custom woods method and manually traced for this and would guess it took a bit less than 10 minutes to trace.

As far as I know, InkScape does not have centerline trace capability. The later versions of CorelDraw do (after version X3 if I remember correctly...I have X6 and it does centerline trace) and so does Adobe Illustrator. Before Corel added centerline trace, I bought Illustrator for that and also to be compatible with my Mac friends' files.