How to do inlays

[Don Butler]

In a video produced by Wood Magazine for their forum site the Craftsman version of the CW is shown to have made inlays and the cutouts for them. They don't go through how its done, though.
Does anyone here know of a step by step how-to or tutorial?

d...

[mtylerfl]

Hi Don,

Can you post a weblink for that?

[Don Butler]

Click on the link.
When the page comes up click the right arrow for more choices, then click Tool Tests and Demos, then select Craftsman CompuCarve.

http://www.woodmagazine.com/wood/file.jsp?item=video/player&temp=yes

d...

[mtylerfl]

Click on the link.
When the page comes up click the right arrow for more choices, then click Tool Tests and Demos, then select Craftsman CompuCarve.

http://www.woodmagazine.com/wood/file.jsp?item=video/player&temp=yes

d...

OK, I watched the video and it was pretty well done. Couple things though...

1) He set up the sign project wrong at the beginning - he made the virtual board in Designer 3.75" longer for the layout at each end, because he said "the machine needs at least 3.5" at each end". That's true, but, it is incorrect to make the layout board with that extra length because then your real board you put into the machine will need to be a total of 7" longer than THAT if you say "YES" to the "Stay Under Rollers" option (which he did). Undoubtedly, he discovered the goofup when he ran the project, but the video is edited and doesn't show that part of it.

2) As far as the inlays go, he never showed the finished inlays, so I'm doubting that he really was able to complete the inlays with the machine. He mentioned the inlay recessed cavities were 1/8" deep and he did show the board with the recessing carved into them. That part was fine.

However, he did not show any actual inlay cutout pieces done on the machine (those would have had to have been cut out of stock with a maximum thickness between 1/8" to 3/16"). All he showed was the design layout mpc in Designer for the cutout pieces. He had cut paths around them, which would not have worked if he tried to run the project with the Designer software version that was available at that time.

My theory is that he did not cut the inlays out with the machine because he discovered the problem of 1/8" thick stock being too thin for the machine to accept, or that he wasn't familiar with building a sled, or he discovered that tabs would not be left on the 1/8" stock even if he did build a sled, or he might not have been able to get the dimensions perfect enough for the inlays due to bit offset issues for the software at that time...or all of the above prevented him from completing the inlay pieces with the machine.

So, I don't believe he actually accomplished that inlay work using only the machine after all! I would have to talk to him personally to verify that for certain, but given the circumstances mentioned above, I do not think it was done. I am open to correction and an explanation of how he did it - if he did it.

I'm not saying the machine can't do simple inlays - a couple of folks have posted pics on the forum showing it is possible (they used 1/2" or 3/4" stock I think). What I am saying is, there is a lot more involved to the technique if trying to do inlay pieces using stock less than 1/2" thick with the automatic cutpaths at that time and with current versions of Designer up to 1.13. So, unless he "revamped" his mpc and also used some means of affixing the 1/8" stock to a thicker board, I am a little more than confident that he did not do the inlay pieces using the project file "as is" that he briefly showed on the demo video.

[Don Butler]

Mike,
Thanks for looking at it. I appreciate your expertise and that's the kind of help we need when taking in some of the things people say about the system.

So, Mr Svec misrepresented the system, making an unwarranted assumption. I guess we might say he forgot the rule of A.S.S.U.M.E.!


d...

[mtylerfl]

Don,

...maybe he cut the inlay pieces with the CW from 1/2" to 3/4" stock and then simply sliced them to the required 1/8" thickness using a bandsaw?

I'm wondering if I can get a hold of him and ask. I think the demo overall was very good - albeit just a little incomplete, leaving a couple head-scratching questions.

[Don Butler]

Mike,
Thinking about securing thin pieces, I wonder about carpet tape? I use it for similar operations on the Legacy Ornamental Mill.

??

d...

[mtylerfl]

Mike,
Thinking about securing thin pieces, I wonder about carpet tape? I use it for similar operations on the Legacy Ornamental Mill.

??

d...

Don,

If you can hold off a little, I think there will be a better solution forthcoming...

[Don Butler]

OK!


d...

[MikeMcCoy]

Don,

If you can hold off a little, I think there will be a better solution forthcoming...


That sounds like a good start of a rumor about a new software version. :cool:

[liquidguitars]

1) He set up the sign project wrong at the beginning - he made the virtual board in Designer 3.75" longer for the layout at each end, because he said "the machine needs at least 3.5" at each end". That's true, but, it is incorrect to make the layout board with that extra length because then your real board you put into the machine will need to be a total of 7" longer than THAT if you say "YES" to the "Stay Under Rollers" option (which he did). Undoubtedly, he discovered the goofup when he ran the project, but the video is edited and doesn't show that part of it.

This is not wrong! My thinking is that its better to add the extra 3.5 or 4 in Desiger and just say "NO" 02 to NOT keep it under the rollers the CW will not change the pattern or scale and will keep it under the rollers everytime.

This way your board will echo the cad layout without any probs making less guess work to the end user...



I'm not saying the machine can't do simple inlays - a couple of folks have posted pics on the forum showing it is possible (they used 1/2" or 3/4" stock I think). What I am saying is, there is a lot more involved to the technique if trying to do inlay pieces using stock less than 1/2" thick with the automatic cutpaths at that time and with current versions of Designer up to 1.13. So, unless he "revamped" his mpc and also used some means of affixing the 1/8" stock to a thicker board, I am a little more than confident that he did not do the inlay pieces using the project file "as is" that he briefly showed on the demo video.

I use thin wood all the time ??? What does 1.130 have to do with inlays working or not?



photo of desiger layout as to the finished board:
LG

[mtylerfl]

This is not wrong!

Hi LG,

Yes, it is wrong if you say "YES" to the "Stay Under Rollers" option. (As was the case in the video demo.)
Re-read the post - I think I made that point clear. Of course, if you use your method, you can safely say "NO" to that option - a point I made in the Dec. '07 Issue of the Tips & Tricks.



I use thin wood all the time ??? What does 1.130 have to do with inlays working or not?

Again, the point I made should have been clear. I apologize if it wasn't. None of the Designer versions so far (up to and including ver. 1.13) can use a standard cut path and leave tabs on material less than 1/2" thick. Additional considerations such as a means of affixing the soon-to-be-loose pieces would have to be performed, and/or manual cut paths would have to be drawn by the user in order for a safe project to be run.

Agreed?

[liquidguitars]

Again, the point I made should have been clear. I apologize if it wasn't. None of the Designer versions so far (up to and including ver. 1.13) can use a standard cut path and leave tabs on material less than 1/2" thick. Additional considerations such as a means of affixing the soon-to-be-loose pieces would have to be performed, and/or manual cut paths would have to be drawn by the user in order for a safe project to be run.

Agreed?

Yes, for auto path buttons.. but untill then 2 sided tape
works well for thin stock. Here is a photo of a sled made for thin wood and the jig is the same as Designers layout:

LG

[mtylerfl]

Yes, for auto path buttons.. but untill then 2 sided tape
works well for thin stock. Here is a photo of a sled made for thin wood and the jig is the same as Designers layout:

LG

That was exactly the point - the fellow in the video could not possibly have done the inlay pieces on stock less than 1/2" thick using the auto cut path (unless he wanted flying pieces knocking around in his machine). Unfortunately, the video strongly implies that he did.You and I know he couldn't have.

You and I also know he couldn't/shouldn't have said "Yes" to the Stay Under Rollers option if he designed his virtual board with the excess length already built-in. (The machine would have caught the error and asked for an even longer board, or worse, reduced the size of the design layout.)

Very important to make these corrections - especially for new carvers so they don't get led "astray".

[cnsranch]

I think Mike and LG are both right.

Re board size, I looked at the video - I think he contradicted himself. He started with making his design 3.75" from the ends of the board size in designer (not necessarily correct), but then when loading the board, he stated that the real board was 3.5" longer on each end than Designer's board. Probably figured out the mistake in the beginning, and corrected it when loading the board. Otherwise, he'd have to tell the CW "no" when asked to stay under the rollers if his real board wasn't longer than Designer's.

Re inlays, Mike, I make "bow ties" all the time to correct/stop splits in a table-top, etc., using the appropriate adapter for my router. The bow tie itself is routed in 3/4" stock, usually 1/8" deep, then the entire piece is run through the bandsaw or tablesaw to separate the tie from the stock. I'm sure that was his plan.

Now, I haven't tried inlays with the CW, but it would be great, assuming that the inlay is the correct size to fit into the recess. It wouldn't be hard to get the measurements set in Designer for the inlay itself, and the recess to place the inlay, but my guess is that the CW would have to be perfectly calibrated, or they wouldn't match up well enough.

[cnsranch]

How about the attached -

If the attached is carved, and the board separated in two (for the sake of this "test"), then the side with the Inlay material run through a bandsaw set just proud of 1/8", the inlay will be separated form the stock, and should fit into the recess perfectly, with a little material to sand or scrape to make it level with the surface - there's your inlay!

Again, the machine better be calibrated perfectly.

This is an overly-simple inlay, but the theory would work with any type of shape, etc (I think).

Does this make sense?

[mtylerfl]

Actually, even that simple inlay won't work.

Why? Because inside corners would be rounded, whilst outside corners would be sharply square.

You would either need to round the outside corners of the inlay manually, or chisel out the inside corners of the recess so they are squared-up to the inlay.

[cnsranch]

You're good.

[gsrice]

Did anyone happen to see a tutorial on this forum a long time ago -- where the guy described -- in detail -- how to do intarsia and inlays ?

I copied the text but don't have the graphics to go with -- it's copyrighted by : CarveWrightForum.com so I don't know if I can pass it on -- however the site is no longer active

Greg