Finishing question.

[bizbiki]

I dont know if this is the right place to ask this question becasue it is not a direct question about the CW but rather a finishing question. Anyway here it goes.

Last month in wood magazine there was an article that had a recipe for a rub on finish using 1 part boiled linseed oil, one part napthala (as a dryer I guess), and one part varnish.

Since I've always loved a Linseed oil finsih for bringing out the grain of wood, and the type of varnish was not specified I wonder it I could substitue Laquer for the varnish??

Any help is always appericiated.

Thanks

Louie

[mtylerfl]

Hi Louie,

I don't think you can make that substitute due to the difference in chemical make-up between laquer and varnish.

However, you could simply mix up a small batch and test it on a scrap to see what happens.

[DocWheeler]

Louie,

Here is an interesting Link. (http://www.woodcentral.com/bparticles/foiloilfin.shtml)

[bizbiki]

Thanks guys, what I am looking for I guess is the beauty of a linseed oil finish with the strength of a varnish.

My idea of using a laquer was for its quick drying capabilities and its strength. I for one havent had too good of luck with polyurathane finishes becasue of their slow drying and the high dust content of my shop. Also with the laquer as you add subsequent coats to the project the coat below melts into the coat above really leveling out any imperfectins in teh finish.

Are there any quick drying varnishes out there that are not polyurathane?

[2upchuck]

I use a product made by ML Campbell called "Krystal". Its a high solid conversion varnish that requires a catalyst. But its harder than lacquer, Drys in 30 min to sand, and sands easier than lacquer or varnish.

Chuck

[FiddlemakerMills]

Are there any quick drying varnishes out there that are not polyurathane?

I use a spirit (alcohol base, compatiable with Linseed oils) varnish for most of my projects. When sprayed on in thin coats the varnish will dry in about 15 min. Then flaten the coat with 000 or 00 grade wool before the next coat. You can also use micro-mesh between each coat. Stepping the grade up to 6000. This results in a finish that has a lot of depth too it.
This finish is of Instrument grade and may be expensive, I think the results are worth the cost and effort.

"Remember the finish is the direct result of the effort that you put into it no matter what type finish is used". (quote from my instructor)

Carl

[cnsranch]

Louie -

That was a great article, I can't wait to try it - seems like even I can't screw it up :p

I don't have access to the article now, but I seem to recall some detail in it re the types of "varnish" you can use. Could be wrong, don't quote me, but I remember them referring to polyurethane as a "varnish" in the article.

Anyways, re-read before you try, I sure will.

[mtylerfl]

Hi Louie,

I've used mostly the Wipe-On Poly by MinWax (both Satin and Gloss). I can get several coats in a day. Has a nice hand-rubbed finish look to it.

Recently though, I have tried using the MinWax Water-Based Polycrylic. I apply a thinned sanding sealer to the raw wood first, then sand lightly, then normally apply the stain then poly. Each coat (depending on the weather) can be sanded lightly after about an hour or so. You can easily apply 4 or 5 coats (or more) in a single day.

I use 320-grit after the first coat or two, then use 600-grit between 3rd and 4th coat. The last coat is not sanded at all if I'm doing a gloss finish. NOTE: By sanding, I mean it's almost just a "brushing or light wiping" of the surface. It's only to remove any miniscule "nubs" before applying the next coat. I also wipe the piece off with a microfiber cloth (NOT beeswax treated cloths!) between coats.

I just finished a soon-to-be-released project for the Monthly Project Subscription where I used the MinWax water-based Polycrylic Clear Gloss. I did not stain the project, but left it natural pine. I did paint a small area to accent the head details, but everything else was left natural. I was EXTREMELY pleased with the finish!

I'll show you a close up of the just the head (a Swan) of the project. (I don't want to reveal the entire project until LHR gives the go ahead or posts it themselves.) Although it may be hard to tell what the finish looks like overall from this small photo, it came out really great over the entire piece.

[cnsranch]

Show-off :D

Beautiful, Mike

[FiddlemakerMills]

I will be looking for that artical,

Wounderful work Mike.

[MikeMcCoy]

Show-off :D

Beautiful, Mike

Yep

That finish almost looks like a lathe friction finish.

[bizbiki]

Thanks for the replies.

The article in Wood Magazine did call for polyurathane as the varnish they used (you are correct CNS) , But I am under the impression that you could use various varnishes for the process.

I did buy some "fast dry" oil based varnish at lunch today from Sherwin Willams and since it is recoatable in 30 minutes (on their website) I dont think that I will have the problem that I normally get with polyurathane.

If I have a chance I will try this tonight (at least on some scrap wood) and let you know how it worked (for me anyway).

[cnsranch]

Mind like a steel trap -

I do have to agree with Mike - I've had the best luck with Min Wax's wipe on poly - refinished an ooolllddd kitchen table for my Mo in law - seven coats of the wipe on, didn't hit it with 0000 steel wool until after the 4th coat, didn't touch it thereafter.

That table's wearing like iron, and the finish is smooth as glass.

Still can't wait to try the finish in Wood's article.

[Jvicaretti]

I can't wait for that project to come out. Are you giving tips on finishing also?

[mtylerfl]

I can't wait for that project to come out. Are you giving tips on finishing also?

Thanks - I can hardly wait myself! I think this one is scheduled for release for the September Project.

Yes, I usually do include the steps of what I did for the finish, but of course a lot of folks have their own favorite methods - no particular "rules"!

By the way, I'm in Atlanta, GA tonight writing this. Tommorrow is my first day at the IWF (International Woodworking Machinery & Furniture Supply Fair). I'll get to meet some of the CarveWright staff at their display booth. Should be a lot of fun!

[FiddlemakerMills]

Say hellow to them for use.

Carl

[Amonaug]

I need more practice with finishes.

What is the best way to get a mirror smooth deep finish?

I'm using a clear gloss brushing laquer that says you shouldn't sand between finishes and it does give a nice shiny finish but "hills & valleys" that deters from a glass smooth finish.

[FiddlemakerMills]

Well to me it is simple, just time consuming.

Step 1, prepair the material to be finished. 220 grit.

Step 2, Apply sealer allow to dry sand to 400 grit and recoat with sealer.

Allow sealer to dry for 48 hrs.

Step 3, Rough dry sealer with 600 grit. And flexable rubber block or pad to flatten the finish.

Step 4, Apply first coat of varnish with air spray gun no higher then 35 lbs.
Allow drying time.

Repeat step 3 and 4 through each grit up to 10,000 micro mesh. Be carefull not to sand through previous layer of varnish. The varnish will appear to dull as you do this. Once it is uniformly dull when held at an angle to the light you are ready for the next coat.

600 grit and above can be the wet sanding process.

Finish with a hard wax and you have it.

The photo is this style of finish applied to Quilted maple.

Hope this helps

Carl

[Amonaug]

Thanks, I had a feeling to truly get it you needed a spray gun which I don't have.......yet :)

[FiddlemakerMills]

I use a tool shop brand that is inexpensive.

Carl

[supershingler]

amonaug

i bought a wagner hvlp kit at the big box store for 99.00 dollars that does a pretty got job for starting out. it does a good job with laquer which is about the only finish i use.

and second i use the air pressure minus the gun to get air to blow out my cw and dont worry about moisture like my air compressor seem to accumulate.

kendall

[Kenm810]

We have small Air Dryer Regulator Combo's at all or Compressed air stations, plus a large one at each 100 gal make up air tank.
The photo of the small unit is of the one I use for spraying my finishes and supplying dry compressed air to my carver.
You can get the small combo's for less than $50.00 at Harbor Freight.

[MikeMcCoy]

Thanks, I had a feeling to truly get it you needed a spray gun which I don't have.......yet :)

I have a Fuji turbine now but I used a cheapo turbine from Harbor Freight for several years. The price was right and it did a surprisingly good job (especially with shellac).