List of problems with software and machine

[hardly]

I have recently purchased the centerline software unlocking key. I have used it once and already I have found it is buggy which ruined yet another piece of wood. I am obviously not very happy with its performance considering its high price.

I am curious what other have found and if they have work arounds, gotten a fix or reply about an upcoming fix from carvewright. So to find out here are problems I've found and suggestions about the software and machine. What have you all experienced about these things?

Centerline software

1. Using the 60 degree bit and High tower text font. The capital letters O and U had a cut through them that went diagonally from the top left to the bottom right of the letter.

2. When editing the text sometimes most of the illustrations of the font in the font window are blank. Sporadic problem though.

3. When changing fonts the size of the text box containing the text changes forcing me to resize the text. I think this should not happen. The text box size should stay the same.

Designer software

1. Many times when moving an element of a pattern the screen does not refresh. This usually leaves part of the element drawn and part missing. I have to slew the pattern left or right or up or down to get it to refresh.

2. I used the arc drawing function. I found it difficult to use when trying to set the starting and ending points of an arc while maintaining a certain radius. It would be much nicer to be able to type in the starting radial and ending radial of the curve as well as the radius. With this typed in then one would only have to move the arc into position. Corel draw handles this nicely.

3. The toggle perspective view and the Toggle Auto Re-render menu items could use a check block, check mark or something to show one if those views are on or off instead of guessing.

4. An import function for DXF or G code or some other 3D standard is needed.

5. The Text tool needs a depth of cut input box.

6. It would be useful to allow a click and drag function for the magnify tool so one could select the region one wanted to magnify.

7. It would be useful to have the center of an object coordinates shown on the screen toolbar along side of the size boxes.

8. The small measurement figures shown for lines and objects are too small to read easily and many times the numbers are obscured by other drawing elements. Those little yellow red and green measurement balls obscure parts of the numbers too.

9. Draw a horizontal line. There will be a vertical green line with a measurement. If you move the left end of the line up the line latches on to the left end of the line. If you move it down past horizontal it moves to the right end of the line and then there is no vertical measurement for the left side of the line. I would personally prefer some absolute measurement of the line ends instead of that green line that moves all around and measures from the closest dash line. Line and object positions need to show measurements more like drawing programs for example corel draw or turbo cad. Then these measurements could be changed to reposition the object.

10. I drew a line with the spline tool. I could not flip a copy of the line with the Flip Horizontal tool. The Flip Vertical tool worked OK though.

11. I drew a line with the spline tool on the left side of the wood. I then created a horizontal mirror image. The image was far to the right. I wanted to have them connected so I dragged them together. When I did so two of the sections of the line distorted into about 270 degree circles. I started over by using Ctrl-Z to get rid of the mirrored line. I move the original line to the right side of the wood. This time after a mirror copy was made when I tried to move them together the lines segments did not distort.

12. With regard to the mirroring tool. There are times when one would want to draw the left side (or top) of a symmetrical object with line segments or spline tool and then mirror it to create the opposite side of the object. It would be nice if there were a mirror function to do this without having to drag the sides together. There is also the problem that when done with current horizontal mirror tool that one can only move the two haves up or down not left or right to reposition the whole object.

13. I had an email program running in the background. When I switched to it I got a warning stating the GUI has stopped working. When I clicked OK the carvewright designer program terminated. This did not happen all the time though as I'd guess I had switched tasks at least a dozen times before the crash. Luckily I had saved the project just before it crashed.

14. I recommend a center an element within another element tool be added.

The machine itself

1. I carved a pattern that used the cutting bit, the carving bit and the 60 degree V bit. At the start the machine had me install each of the 3 bits so it could measure and find the surface for each bit. I can understand this (for the starting bit) but during the carving when it changed to a different bit it went through the finding the surface routine again for each bit. How about eliminating this double installing/measuring of the bits and have it do it once at the start of the use of each bit?

2. I have the scanning probe. I bought it because the advertisement stated it could trace objects made even of clay. Then later I read in this forum that the probe scratches and chips off paint. Now I am very reluctant to have it scan anything valuable or soft as clay. I hope this can be fixed so it operates as advertised.

So, what say you all?

Regards
Terry

[Jeff_Birt]

Items 1-2:This all has to do with how the font is designed. You should be using truetype fonts (vector) fonts not bitmap fonts. Even then the way some fonts are designed they do not lend them selves to centerline. IF you would spend a bit of time searcing on the subject of centerline you would find that folks have mentioned what fonts have or have not worked for them.

3: The box outlining your text on the board just shows you the size of the box that it takes to contain your text (i.e. bounding box) . Different fonts have different size descenders etc. If you change fonts of course the bounding box will change. There is no easy way at this point to fix an equivalent to point size when placing text on the board.

5: You can change depth of text for raster type text, but not centerline. The depth centerline is carved is a function of the width of stroke.

11-12: Mirroring currently has its quirks. I understand that CW is aware of this and is working on it.

13: What version of Designer are you running? Update to the latest version 1.126 as it contains several stability improvements.

Machine
1: That's how it works. The machine has to be sure that you are indeed installing the correct bit when it is called for in the carving. So it compares the reading taken before the carving begins to those when it asks for the various bits during carving. That way it keeps you from goofing.


As for your list of 'suggestions'. Add them to the CarveWright Designer Wish List thread. CW does key an eye on that thread.

I would suggest spending a bit of time with the search function. Most if the questions you have could have been answered with a search and you might have learned a thing or two about how the machine operates.

[Woodman]

I haven't tried this yet but am going to give it a go as soon as I get my machine back from Houston (!) since it decided to eat it's spindle bearings after 30 hours (!). . . . I'm going to dip the end of the probe in a two part acrylic solution I get from Hobby Lobby. This stuff is quite hard when it sets up and dries for 23 hours. It deposits a very thin layer on whatever you put it on and I probably will use two or three coats depending on how thick it ends up being on the end of the probe. If it doesn't work, I can always take it off and try something else. I've heard that glue applicators work too but the only ones I've found so far have holes in the ends of them. Just a thought. . . . Pete

[badger]

I've heard that glue applicators work too but the only ones I've found so far have holes in the ends of them. Just a thought. . . . Pete



Most of the hobby stores carry the applicators. I found mine at Hobby Lobby. Ive also tried to manipulate the probe a bit by trying extended tips and have been able to probe items at a little better depth. Yes it shows up in designer as over 1" however that is quickly fixed in the depth box and reduced.

[hardly]

Thanks for the tip but I guess I don't understand the reason for the applicator tip or the 2 part paint. An applicator would seem to have a wide tip. Don't you need a sharp or small tip for accuracy? Is the applicator to pad the tip? In which case does that not affect its accuracy? Or is it to provide a slipery surface so it won't scratch? Does the applicator or paint help the sensativity of the probe so that a clay model can be scanned? Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks,
Terry

[Kenm810]

This is not a great photo, but you can see the tips are quite small, and can be bought without a hole in the end.
They do a reasonable job of padding the probe tip while not loosing to much detail,
plus they definitely help to prevent the scanning probe form scratching an item being scanned.
I've seen them in a few different sizes at craft or hobby stores.

[bdehoyos]

This is not a great photo, but you can see the tips are quite small, and can be bought without a hole in the end.
They do a reasonable job of padding the probe tip while not loosing to much detail,
plus they definitely help to prevent the scanning probe form scratching an item being scanned.
I've seen them in a few different sizes at craft or hobby stores.

how do you fastened the tip to the probe? Do you have pics?

[Reset]

I just stuck the tip on the end of the probe...and it stayed there :)

The glass bead idea looks interesting...but I havn't had a chance to try it out myself, so I cannot comment :)

http://www.carvewright.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4565&highlight=softer+scanning


Tommy :)

[Kenm810]

Reset is right, the Glue tip fits like a sleeve
and holds it's self in place until you pull it off.

[Digitalwoodshop]

"I have recently purchased the centerline software unlocking key. I have used it once and already I have found it is buggy which ruined yet another piece of wood. I am obviously not very happy with its performance considering its high price. "

Terry,

This is a hobby quality machine that does have it's limitations. For the price, in my opinion, it does very well.

The lesson here is that you need to set up a mpc with any font you plan to use and do a test cut in pine proving it will work. Even setting the letter spacing away from Zero can cause some fonts to not cut properly.

Now that you know the limitations, you can work within them. Improvements are continually being made by LHR. The other option is to box it up and return it as it did not meet your expiations. And that wouldn't be any fun.....

AL

[hardly]

Hello Jeff,

I see you are listed as a moderator. I do not mean to sound flippant as I do not mean to be but so I get an idea about your access level are you employed by carvewright as a programmer or are you a volunteer moderator who just likes the machine?

"Items 1-2:This all has to do with how the font is designed. You should be using truetype fonts (vector) fonts not bitmap fonts."

I understand. The font I used, High Tower, is a TT font. I switched to another font and it worked satisfactorily. Still, for the price it should work well with all TT fonts and better yet, with all fonts. BTW the software is advertised to work with "fonts already installed on your computer." No mention of it being limited to TT.

"IF you would spend a bit of time searcing on the subject of centerline you would find that folks have mentioned what fonts have or have not worked for them."

Now that would only help if they mentioned the fonts I needed to use.

"3: The box outlining your text on the board just shows you the size of the box that it takes to contain your text (i.e. bounding box) . Different fonts have different size descenders etc. If you change fonts of course the bounding box will change. There is no easy way at this point to fix an equivalent to point size when placing text on the board."

After I switched fonts I resized that box to what it was before to bring the new font back to the same size as the previous font. Seems to me the software could at least do the same thing that I did when I resized the box out to its former size. Resizing is something the software already does so it should not be a big leap.

11-12: Mirroring currently has its quirks. I understand that CW is aware of this and is working on it.

That is good. Any estimated time frame?

"13: What version of Designer are you running?"

I'm running 1.126.

"Machine
1: That's how it works. The machine has to be sure that you are indeed installing the correct bit when it is called for in the carving. So it compares the reading taken before the carving begins to those when it asks for the various bits during carving. That way it keeps you from goofing."

I have to disagree based on observation and testing. It seems to care less about what bits are loaded when it initially starts. The measurements taken the second time through seem to be what it really uses to cut. I saw no evidence it compared the two readings nor did I get any errors. I base this on three runs I did that used three bits each. The carvings used the carving bit, the cutting bit and the 60 degree V bit. For the first run I changed all three bits as requested, twice. For the 2nd and 3rd runs when I started the machine it asked for me to load each of the three bits one after the other. I, however, did not change bits, I left the carving bit in for all three measurements. Then it started carving. Once the carving was done it asked for the V bit. I put that in and it measured it (found the surface again) the second time. The V bit did its thing. Lastly it asked for the cutting bit. I put that in and again it measured for the surface. In all three trials the carvings look the same which is why I say it does not really care about what bit is loaded during the first time through the measurement cycle prior to doing any cutting.

"As for your list of 'suggestions'. Add them to the CarveWright Designer Wish List thread. CW does key an eye on that thread."

I can do that.

"I would suggest spending a bit of time with the search function. Most if the questions you have could have been answered with a search and you might have learned a thing or two about how the machine operates."

Hmmm. Rather insulting. A machine's operators manual is where one should initially learn how to use a machine. When that fails then there is tech support or failing that there may be a forum where users help other users out by answering questions. Perhaps carvewright or someone connected with the forum should go through all those thousands of past posts and create a better FAQ from them.

Regards
Terry

[Jeff_Birt]

I'm a volunteer moderator....and I like the machine.

While you 'CAN' use bitmap fonts you will not be happy with the results, TT fonts (most fonts now-days) will work much better. Still, the SW is trying to guess as to how a font would be drawn with a pen and use that information to generate a cutting path. Some fonts, by the way they are designed, work much better than others. Do google for 'single stroke fonts', these are fonts specifically designed for engraving and the like. In other works they are designed to be easily interpreted and machine produced.

In most any graphics package I have used the bounding box is generated to show the bounds of what ever object I create. I can then pull on the bounding box to resize the object, but I cannot use the bounding box as a constraint for further object manipulation. If I type more text into CorelDraw the size of the bounding box changes with the text. Now, it would be nice to be able to fix a height for text in Desinger. I'm not sure how that would be done as different fonts at the same point size have different apparent heights. (I'll ask my Dad how he handled that laying out newspaper ads back in the day.)




I have to disagree based on observation and testing. It seems to care less about what bits are loaded when it initially starts.

You were just lucky. It only finds the board surface once per side of board, that is at the very beginning of the run. Some folks here have found out the hard way by accidentally switching carving bits that a little height difference between the two bits can cause problems.


As for the suggestion to employ the 'Search' feature. It was not meant to be insulting at all. As you have mentioned there are many avenues of finding the information you need. Searching this forum is just one of the best/quickest. CW could write a 1,000 page manual on the machine/SW and while you and I would read it, 90% of folks would not. That is just human nature. I have considered writing a very comprehensive guide to the machine and SW but fear that there will be no market for it.

[bdehoyos]

I agree with Hardly

There should be a full users manual with samples, pictures do’s and don’ts.

Completely illustrated (pictures not drawings) on how to clean, lube the machine.

There should be a better quality control, I find very disturbing that we can not trust the quality control at LHR assembly line and, we are required to verity if all the screws are tight on a new piece of equipment. We are also required to lube the flexshaft before its first use. Only because poor quality control at the assembly line

Imagine the law suits that will befall if we where required by FORD or any automaker to lube the engine or drive systems on our new car before we use it for the first time, to verify that the door screws are tight because of you don’t the door might fall when you drive

I understand that the machines are made in china but I’ve been at the maquiladora industry for more than 20 years I can assure you that the quality of Mexican labor is far better that that of Chinese labors.

[Jeff_Birt]

Arggg! Gentlemen you have both completely missed my point: is it not better to avail yourself of all sources of information (manuals, forum/forum search, tech support) than set around and complain about how you think the user manual is inadequate. :)

The OP's original comments/questions had nothing to do with quality or country of origin, so let us stick to the point, OK?

[jackssib1]

I have wasted lots of wood trying to find right text to use.
oh well, i guess it a small prob. Sorry
Jack

[Jeff_Birt]

No, Jack not a small problem. It would be nice to have more folks contribute what fonts they use that work well with centerline.

[jackssib1]

Writing down the one that work for me.
Jack

Thanks

[jj8950]

I think the thread was problems with machine and sw.....the quality control of LHR is lousey, 2 machines...first one i got would not crank down all the way (2") to be exact, I was told to take apart the machine and try fixing it myself, the second, the Z truck was loose and the bits would not seat in the chuck no matter what i did.....the bottom plate on it was dented in so bad it looked as if someone had kicked it. When I sent back the second and UPS had misplaced it, I was discreetly reminded that lhr HAD ATTORNEYS THAT HANDLED THIS KIND OF THING....
THATS JUST MY 2 CENTS......PS they got back their machine which was misplaced....