To Loctite or not to Loctite...

[DStimpson]

I realize that blue Loctite is our friend and would NEVER consider not using it on things like bit adapter screws..... but is it really necessary on the threads of the QC when you are changing it out?? It seems to me that the direction of rotation keeps the QC tightening in the right direction. Not using Loctite on those internal QC threads would make it easier to remove the chuck to really clean it well, or to change it out again, if need be.

Just wondering.......

David S.

[ncamp]

Not using it allows the qc to move when running as well. Loctite comes in different strengths. The strong stuff needs to be heated to get it to release. The medium only requires extra force.

I found this link that explanes the differences fairly well:
http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/loctite/index.shtml

[Jeff_Birt]

It seems to me that the direction of rotation keeps the QC tightening in the right direction.

But, ONLY when the cut motor is running. When the cut motor stops running the small bit of momentum that that bit/adapter/chuck has will work the opposite way and eventually unscrew the chuck.

[Gunner]

You must use the loctite. The vibration from carving can cause the QC to back off the threads if not secured in place. The alternative would be to add a lockwasher and locknut to the assembly. I don't see enough room to do that. Nor would I recomend it. The machine was not designed with this in mind. I believe RJustice is working on a new design for the QC, but, he hasn't released it yet.

[rjustice]

There are two kinds of carvers, those that have replaced the QC, and those that will! (unless you just like the look of the high tech machine hanging out in your shop collecting dust from other machines!);)

While testing the tools that i made for changing out the QC, i did several tests to make sure the tool i produced was constructed of a material that was able to be heat treated to the point of being "Tough", but not "Brittle"..
In my experiments i removed and replaced a chuck 10-15 times, and did everything from coating the whole spindle threads with BLUE Loctite, to just a drip, and found that if you put a drip about an 1/8 inch in diameter on the threads of the spindle before screwing the chuck back on, it is sufficent to keep the chuck from wanting to back off without heat, but yet allow for removal with one good soaking with the heat gun to remove it without damaging the chuck.

If you coat the entire threads you will have to soak it a few times to get it off, and can quite likely end up melting the overmolded plastic that holds the chuck together.

If you are ever in question about using RED Loctite-DO NOT USE IT!!!! no matter what anyone says. I have had 3 customers now that said that they were told "if that was all they had, it would work fine".... BEWARE, that if you do use the RED, you will have to take a torch, intentially melt off the plastic, and get the steel part of the chuck almost red hot to get it to break loose... The risk of ruining the seals on the bearings, and liquifying the lube inside the bearings to the point of it running out is very high! It will no doubt just be a matter of time before you will have to replace the lower bearing. This is not an easy job at all, so just avoid it!

I definitely recommend wiping off the threads with rubbing alcohol, then applying a drip of the BLUE loctite on the spindle threads to re-assemble! Your next change out will be very easy.

Drop me an email if you need the tools, and detailed instructions!

Happy Carving!

Ron

[Digitalwoodshop]

I can attest that there is significant mass in the QC that during deceleration it will start to back off the threads. I got one back from LHR without blue thread lock and within a day the QC was loose.

AL

[ncamp]

The only thing I use Red for are the set screws for the bit adapters. Blue everywhere else that needs it.

[DStimpson]

Good information everyone, thank you. I shall continue to use the BLUE Loctite, albeit observing Mr. Justice's advice re the amount.

Ron, I will be very interested to see your version of the QC...I suspect it will be a more robust version.

When do you anticipate it's release??

[rjustice]

There will be at least two versions, and possibly three. I have the first one manufactured and has been, and is in testing right now.

I am going to offer it in 1/8, 1/4, 3/8, and 1/2". At this point I am happy with it's performance, and ready to move forward. I am hoping to be able to get some manufactured next weekend, and get them Black Oxide coated and ready to offer for sale in about 2 weeks or less.

I will announce the release here in the forum, and also send an email out to anyone that has emailed me for info in the past.

Thanks for your inquiry,

Happy Carving!

Ron

[Dan-Woodman]

Ron
Any hint as to type of QC it will be, like will it use the CW adapters, or will it be the type you put the bit in the chuck and tighten down with a setscrew, etc?
later Daniel

[rjustice]

This first release is going to screw on and off of the spindle threads against a jam nut that stays on the machine via blue locktite, and a nylock setscrew.

The bits are held in a holder via one setscrew using BLUE Loctite, and will stay in that holder. To change the tool from the machine, you will loosen one nylock setscrew, and unscrew the holder off of the spindle, then screw the next one on, then tighten up the nylock setscrew again.

This solution will work very well for most people, but admittedly will not be as "quick" as the QC.

The next release will most likely be the "Collet" style. I truly dont think this is the real solution, but many have asked for this option.

The third release will be something more like the QC, only different actuation. Either an Air release, a Tapered setscrew, or a lever. I have sound designs on all three, but havent manufactured any yet or tested. I think this is the ultimate solution, but it is going to be more expensive, and there may be the necessity to change out the spindle. Especially if i go with the air actuated version. The cool thing about the air option is that i can build air blow off into the spindle which will cool the bearings, and provide a blow off always directed perfectly at the tip of the tool...

Any feedback is welcomed!

Thanks again for your interest everyone!

Happy Carving,

Ron

[Spanglerg@hotmail.com]

I've been using loctite for many years, Blue/Red/Yellow404, in numerous industrial applications and have found that applying heat is probably the last option I would consider. Generally, acetone applied w/ eyedropper, ear syringe, ECT, will penetrate, and release the adhesion. The downside is the safe handling of acetone. I would not recommend this process unless extreme caution is exercised, like reading and understanding the MSDS.

[Kenm810]

JARBOON,

Thanks for the info, it's a useful option to remember.
We've been using acetone around the shops and studios for years.
But very seldom had a need for blue or red loctite, and even more rarely needed to loosen it again after it was applied.
We do have eyedroppers and several sizes of syringes that are used in our work everyday.
So between the acetone, heat guns and Ron's (rjustice) QC Chuck tools we have,
I feel a little more prepared and confident to face a QCC replacement on my machine when needed.

Thanks Again