Carving bit does not show up in software

[bobgrosh]

The bits selection in the software for the patterns are:
1/4" ball tip
1/8" ball tip
1/16" ball tip
1/8" straight
The machine came with a 1/8" straight and a tapered (carving bit).

Two questions:

How do I load, install, activate, access the tapered carving bit in the software so I can see accurate previews on screen of the actual carving with bit optimization set to "best" when I intend to use the tapered bit?

Where can I get the "real" ball tip bits that match the ones simulated in the software?

So far, the only way to make an accurate carving of what is shown on screen is to select the straight 1/8" bit. Why in the world the software does not match the bits that come with the machine or are sold by Carve-Wright is a mystery to me.
BoB

[Charles M]

BoB,

The 1/16" ball tip is the same bit as the tapered carving bit. Maybe if you post the project we can better understand what you are after.

[Jeff_Birt]

Bob the 1/16" ball nose IS the 1/16" carving bit. You need to do absolutly nothing to be able to use it in the software. In the board settings dialog you can select another carving bit to use rather than the 1/16" if you wish (not advised). The carving bit is what is used in the 'raster' mode, that is when the machine moves the Y-truck rapidly F-R, and then advances the X-axis; the Z-axis follows the contour to be cut. When you do vector cuts, that is when the bit follows a line that you draw on the board, you can select the bit to be used. All the bits the CW sells are already set up in the software (plus a few others). It has been runerd that a future version of software will allow the user to define their own bits.

[bobgrosh]

BoB,

The 1/16" ball tip is the same bit as the tapered carving bit. Maybe if you post the project we can better understand what you are after.

No, it is not, the carving bit is tapered, not straight. Nor does it have a ball on the end, so it does not make a 1/32" fillet. Also, the 1/4" ball tip bits sold by carvewright can not be used for carving more than 3/8" deep. There are no teeth on the sides. It is a plunge bit and if used to carve patterns more than 3/8" deep it will fault out the machine or break the bit. (Don't know which, haven't tried it, but obviously it can not move sidways once it is deeper than the head of the bit.)

This leaves me with only one bit where the software preview matches the actual results, the (real) cutting bit and the 1/4" flat ended (software) bit.

Here is a picture of the project.
http://www.carvewright.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3729&stc=1&d=1179336599

[liquidguitars]

set up designer to use the 1/8 cut bit...

[pkunk]

No, it is not, the carving bit is tapered, not straight. Nor does it have a ball on the end, so it does not make a 1/32" fillet.

I will have to say that you are wrong. The carving bit supplied by CW that we all are using is the 1/16" ball nose bit refered to in the software.
What you are trying to do in the image that you posted may not be possible at this time within the software & it's limitations in selecting a bit which will do what you want.

[bobgrosh]

set up designer to use the 1/8 cut bit...

That seems to be the only answer.

Using the 1/8. does yield rectangular beams on the underfloor of the flatcar. The only drawback is that there are larger fillets where two beams intersect.

I just don't understand why CarveWright didn't provide a software bit that matches the actual carving bit, this makes the rendered picture all wrong, showing beams and characters with the top face much wider that they will really be when carved.

It's not a matter of can the project be done, it is a matter of the incredible complications involved in drawing the bit image if using the carving bit, one must make the top surface wider to compensate for the taper of the carving bit based on how deep the surrounding objects are. This is so difficult that it renders the carving bit useless for just about any project I envision doing.

As to being wrong about the bit, I guess I MIGHT have gotten an odd ball bit, but I don't think so. Both the sears and CarveWright manuals clearly show a tapered bit and identify it as the carving bit. How, using designer, draw a line starting on the board and extending off the edge. Select the 1/8" ball tip bit and set the view to "best" . Turn the board and zoom in to see the cut.

It should look like this:
http://www.carvewright.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3730&stc=1&d=1179343705

Notice it looks like a tall narrow capital "U" IE a straight ball tip bit.

Now carve the board using the "Carving bit" that came with the machine. Look at it's edge, you will see a tall capital "V" (Vee), Not at all like the view seen in Designer.



I am in awe of the ability of Designer to render accurate views of the carvings, including all the different bits, except for one small omission, the lack of a simple bit definition for the carving bit.

CarveWright does provide bit definitions for all the other bits, including the 1/16 ball tip, which apparently caused problems and is no longer offered. So Why is the bit definition for the carving bit not included in the software? If it was included then it would be clearly visible in Designer why small text ends up being a thin wedge shaped line instead of nicely formed letters with a flat top surface. One could easily avoid wasting a 30 dollar board trying to carve out logos with thin lines or letters, only to discover that a deep cut next to the letters caused them to be whacked off. You could see the problem clearly in Designer prior to carving the board. Isn't that what a Designer is supposed to do, let you see the project before you make sawdust?


Most of the projects I envisioned doing require straight vertical cuts. For example, the window frames and trim on a doll house. The timbers of a garden railroad trestle, the under-frames of railroad cars. Theses are all scale models. A 4" window frame trim or an 8" X 10" timber is scaled down to the correct size and accurately drawn in Designer. If I select the 1/8" bit in Designer and and carve using the real 1/8" bit the window frame comes out exactly to scale. If I do the same thing using the 1/16" ball tip bit in designer, then use the real carving bit, the window frame is too narrow, that would be easy to compensate for, just make the frame wider in Designer. That works for carving a window frame on a doll house where the siding is flat, like plywood siding, but not for clapboard siding, using the carving bit there results in the edge of the window frame having a saw tooth caused by the tapered bit going deeper on each board of the siding. One would not notice this problem until the board was carved. That is because Designer uses a straight ball tip to render the view seen on the monitor, while the CarveWright uses a tapered bit. If CarveWright included the correct carving bit profile in the software, the view would easily show up the problem and it could be corrected before the board is carved.

Saying the carving bit is a ball tip bit, because you use it as the carving bit does not make it so. If all you carve is simple rounded bumps on wood, then you may not have noticed the difference.

[liquidguitars]

One thing is that custom 1/16 bits tend to snap regardless, but I recall a fretboard carve i did, and designer showed the selected 1/4 pattern bits, results. Remeber you will have to wait 2 sec or so for the rendering to finish up.

BTW the 1/8 bit kicks some @#^^ and cuts like butter, I use them for square work.

LG

[Jeff_Birt]

Bob, the carving bit is a 1/16" ball nose tapered bit, so no matter what you do it wont produce striaght sides. You are correct that the profile looks more like a 'V' this is from the taper. If you had a straight ballnose bit it would of course have more of a 'U' profile. Both bits however do have a 1/32 radius ball on the end. (see here (http://precisebits.com/products/carbidebits/taperedcarve250b4f.asp?txtsearchParamTxt=tapered&txtsearchParamCat=ALL&I1.x=0&I1.y=0&txtsearchParamType=ALL&iLevel=1&txtsearchParamMan=ALL&txtsearchParamVen=ALL&txtFromSearch=fromSearch) for a good picture). Designer sometimes does not properly account for the bit's taper in the on screen preview, the deeper your project the larger the discrtepency. Depending on your object geometry you can try adjusting the 'Bit Optimization' setting, sometimes settign this up makes things worse though.

I had not previously noticed that the 1/16" ballnose in the bit selection dialog WAS NOT the 1/16" tapered carving bit. That's interesting. I would assume that a 1/16" bit could be used (hopefuully the feeds and speeds are set properly in the Designer software.) I'll have to try and scrounge one up at work and try.

From the looks of your project it looks like your best choice would be the 1/8" striaght bit.

[Charles M]

Bob,

A 1/16" diameter round nose carbide bit that is 1/16" diameter along its cutting length will snap if you breath on it too hard. Perhaps you could use a high speed steel mill and have less tendency to snap but it won't cut as long as carbide.

[cycollins]

Path-carving in Designer with the narrow bits is a little misleading. I created sample path-carving project and it allows the choice of both a 1/16" straight and 1/16" ball-nose bit. The cut-away diagram for each shows a straight flat and ball-nose profile. Furthermore, it allows you to choose an arbitrary depth for such carved paths (up to an inch of course). The result in designer is exactly what you would expect (a straight plunge 1/16" in width with a straight or ball-nosed groove at the bottom). There's no way the 1/16" carving bit would ever produce that result. Anyone who has ever glanced at the carving bit knows that it is only 1/16" at the very tip and that it slopes out fairly aggressively as one moves up the shank. The best non-CarveWright description of such a bit would be a ~22 degree v-groove bit with a ~1" cutting depth. The thing that makes it unique is that isn't sharp at the tip, but rather has a 1/16" - diameter ball-nosed tip. It's strikes a pretty good balance for a bit that can remove material from the top of your pattern and still define pretty sharp detail. I've looked fairly aggressively for similar bits among standard vendors and it's pretty much unique to the CW platform. What I'd love to find is one that remains a little narrower for more of its cutting depth (a curved profile rather than a V-shaped one), so that deep patterns with dramatic vertical slopes, don't get mysteriously reduced to 22-degree slopes by the carving bit.

There are vendors (especially the high-end ones like CMT) that have straight and ball-nosed 1/16" plunge bits, but they NEVER have cutting depths greater than a 1/2" and much more commonly about 3/16" (to avoid breakage). Even our 1/8" cutter, with its 1" cutting depth is basically unique to the CW world of bits (a lot of vendors won't go that deep for fear of breakage). When you choose the 1/16" straight bit in the designer and specify a 3/4 inch depth, the result is basically a theoretical abstraction. There's no way to get such a groove because it's very likely that 1/16" inch straight bit with 3/4" cutting depth would self-destruct on its way down (at least that's what most vendors would have you believe). I bought a 1/16" straight bit from CMT just out of interest. I'm going to put it in an adapter and see what the CW does when I tell it to make a 1/16" trench. I assume it will do it, but I'm wondering if it will snap off the instant it hits the wood. I have a ghoulish Gomez Addams kind of interest in what will happen. I also found some 1/8" inch shank carbide "plotter" bits (for some strange European X-Y controlled device that can do precision path cuts) that have cutting diameters of as little as 1/32" and 1/8-1/4 inch adapters. Yes, I'm sure they'll snap to pieces as they approach the wood out of fear alone, but I've been toying with the idea of multi-pass carving, using progressively finer bits, so most of the material will have been cleared away by more robust bits before I try these babies. Stay tuned.

cycollins