Inlay Technique for STARS

[PSQRD]

I've approached the forum about this before with no success. I am hoping with as time has passed someone has come up with some ways of utilizing the software to suit these needs - I will post the link as follows : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITrF_PChtZk I am ng to see if anyone has attempted something like this with any success both for the v- inlay technique and/or a technique for inlaying that many stars. I know it can be done on the carvewright and if all else fails I will attempt the trial and error blindly but I know someone on here with a little more know how than I may have something to add. I'm not sure if I will be making the cutting board end grain like mtmwood in the video but I will definitely make the attempt with separate species and am not interested in trying to color epoxy before I get the suggestion - I'm aware of the method but am really trying to do an inlay. Hopefully someone can help. Thank you in advance!
Paul

[oscarl48]

Paul, Interesting. I've never done this and not sure if you mean using the CW software only but with 3d software I think it is relatively easy to do. My concern would be the thickness of the 1/16" carving bit. I think I would go with 1 inch stars at the smallest.

This pattern literally took me 30 seconds to do.

I'll do a test carve this weekend to see how they look. It may be a good technique for me to learn. I've done inlays the old fashioned way before hand and it is time consuming.

- Oscar

P.S. Not sure I'll have much time this weekend so here are the patterns. If you get to it first let me know how they come out.

P.P.S. Thinking about this a little bit. It may be a two step carve were the star cavity is carved using dxf with the 90 or 45 bit and the star is carved with the carving bit. Since I don't have, use or need the dxf add-on someone else may have to chime in.

[gashawk]

The software carves either side the line, doesn't it? Is that close enough? Can you use feather and draft for the taper?

[oscarl48]

That is my thought as well. If I have time this weekend I will test carve to see how rounded the sharp edges become at different sizes. For somewhat larger stars (or shapes in general) it shouldn't be that big of a deal but the smaller the more pronounced the rounded edge affect due to the thickness of the bit.

[PSQRD]

I understand where y'all are coming from with carving and/or cutting inside or outside the line. Doing it as a raster may work but I don't know if this will work in all circumstances if it does indeed work depending on inlay type. My thoughts were to use a vector line and offset/negative offset the radius of the straight bit to avoid taper for traditional inlays but for this technique I figured the same would be accomplished followed by assigning th v bit to both positive and negative pieces and offsetting the radius of the v bit for both positive and negative pieced but that radius would probably vary depending on v bit depth. I will try giving it a shot this weekend oscar, I'm in hopes we can discover a new technique on the CW- maybe something they can create an algorithm for in pattern editor eventually. I suppose the taper on the 1/16th bit can be used in the same fashion as a V bit for an inlay creating two mating surfaces similar to a French cleat

[gashawk]

The software carves either side the line, doesn't it? Is that close enough? Can you use feather and draft for the taper?
Just thinking, draft can change the size. Like on fonts.

[oscarl48]

Well the technique works to a certain extent. I think the limit is 3/4 inch before it fails (at least with the 1/16 bit). Test carved on some scrap pieces I had lying around. Turned out to be cherry and poplar. I would never actually use those together in a real project but they were on top of my scrap bin so used them.

I still think the smallest I would go is 1 inch with this technique but it is definitely doable with 3/4 in stars. I guess it all depends on the project.

They do look good though.

- O

[bergerud]

They do look good. Nice experiment.

[Canemaker]

As usual great job,,, keep up the experiments that how we all learn.

[DevvyM]

P2WW,

Attached are the files I use to carve the stars for the union on the US. Flag. I have different sizes, depending on the size of the flag. The carve time is about 1 hr 45 minutes, but the results are amazing! All boards are 3/4 in.

Small flag - 13"X24.5"...I cut down the 1.5" in pine farring strips into one strips Star: .7"
Medium Flag - 19.5x37"... I use the 1.5" pine strips Star: 1.1"
Large Flag - 26"X48"...I use the 2" pine boards Star: 1.4"

I uploaded the small flag with one set of stars missing (last 9) because the file was too big to load. If this is what you are looking for. You should be able to add them back by copying and pasting a row.

Dev

[PSQRD]

I appreciate the help Dev. For making a flag and just having stars carved in this would be amazing and I may use it for that. What I was currently looking for was a method for doing an inlay of the stars in contrasting wood to use for a cutting board for example. I appreciate the help.
Paul

[PSQRD]

Well the technique works to a certain extent. I think the limit is 3/4 inch before it fails (at least with the 1/16 bit). Test carved on some scrap pieces I had lying around. Turned out to be cherry and poplar. I would never actually use those together in a real project but they were on top of my scrap bin so used them.

I still think the smallest I would go is 1 inch with this technique but it is definitely doable with 3/4 in stars. I guess it all depends on the project.

They do look good though.

- O
Well I'll be! The raster approach was a different way of going about the v bit inlay and I was iffy but they turned out pretty nicely! Once I get my leg healed up from surgery and some PM on my machine I will play around with your method and am going to attempt the v bit method if I can get my head wrapped around it. I've seen MTM WOOD do some pretty small thin inlays that I was surprised would even work. I realize there are some drawbacks from our CNC vs his $50,000 machine but it wouldn't hurt to give it a shot and if it works out maybe establish a method. I really appreciate it Oscar!
-Paul

[oscarl48]

Paul,

I made the mistake of showing my wife the inlaid stars. She is demanding an American Flag for a wall decoration. I think I'll be using black walnut for the star field, maple for the stars and mahogany and maple or cherry for the stripes. lol. Thanks!

- Oscar

P.S. Finished making the patterns for the flag. Final dimensions on the flag are 16.25 x 24.375 inches. Star field is 12 x 8.75 inches. This allows me stripes to be 1.25 inches wide.

Carve time around 2 hours for the inlay and stars as two separate carves. (~51 minutes inlay and 1:10 for stars).

Not as horrible as I thought it would be. Did a quick depth profile star comparison (which I assume is similar to dxf carve time) and you save about 40 minutes vs raster. You will still have to raster the stars I think so no time savings there. I'll post pictures when complete in some future time.

[PSQRD]

Maaan I can relate! haha, my wife gets a hint of something that's cool and it gets added to the honey do list regardless of how simple or complex. I'm really excited in multiple ways, one because of the progress of this idea but also because it's driving someone else (you ) to take the idea and run with it. Keep me posted with updates, if I can find the video link for the really small inlay I'll post it here for you to check out - more food for thought on the idea, still really interested in the flag you're making, good luck!
Paul

[oscarl48]

First attempt ended in failure. I attempted to replicate the video I saw where the stars were carved as a positive and negative and then glued together.

To attempt to keep them exactly the same by inverting the positive to get the negative pattern. The carves just did not line up. The first row kind of fit but the end of the board they were completely misaligned. Tomorrow I'll slice the stars separately and see how they fit.

- O

[PSQRD]

Interesting - I found an ebook type write up written by someone on v bit inlays for conventional CNC's. I am still curious and will stay tuned on your progress, once I get back on my feet, as I mentioned before I will give the v bit method a go. I'll rate my attempt a pass or fail based off of being able to do multiple stars in one shot like you are now. Fingers crossed*, I hope chopping up the stars works for you brother, walnut doesn't make good firewood ;) .

[oscarl48]

Paul, the v-inlay should work. May take a little experimenting to get the v bit inlay to match the star inserts. The way I did it also works but I did something wrong. I had to have inadvertently changed the dimension of the pattern as I was tweaking the pattern. It was way off.

You are right on the cost of the hardwood. Picked up 3 bft of black walnut and 4 bft of cherry and left the store 80 dollars poorer. The prices have gone up a lot locally for hardwoods.

I have 15 stars glued in and 35 more to go. I did break a star while I was cutting them up so will have to carve a few more. It looks like it will work but really slow going since I have to glue each star individually. Should have it done by next weekend. Plan to do a few stars every night after work.

- O

[PSQRD]

Regardless, 1) you're still managing to salvage that walnut and 2) when it's finished the contrast is going to look awesome - keep us updated!

[oscarl48]

Failure. I got impatient and tried to do several at one time where I thought they aligned okay. They didn't. - scrap wood

Tried a second time. Even though the inlay and proud sections were inverse of each other and I made sure the wood blanks were exactly the same they were still way off in alignment. I also had a lot of errors where it kept saying reinsert the card which meant I had to restart the machine. That probably added a lot of error to the carve. Overall I just don't think "my" machine has the precision to accomplish this technique consistently. Even a 1/32 deviation can start impacting the overlap. -scrap wood

Having said that the CW can accomplish the project easily with gluing each star individually negating the precision over a large area issue. These were expensive failures with the black walnut and maple blanks.

I'll start the third attempt with gluing in individual stars today. Time consuming but the results are excellent.

[oscarl48]

Third attempt.

Finished the inlays today. Really time consuming with cutting out each star and gluing each one individually but it came out great. Need to cut out the stripes and glue them together tonight. Should have pictures of the finished project tomorrow. I'll post in my weekend projects thread.

For individual inlays this technique definitely works (at least on raster since I don't have the dxf addon)

Happy carving

- Oscar

[oscarl48]

Well, it looks like I am going to have to wait till next weekend to finish my flag. I had bought just enough black walnut to finish the project. With the first two failed attempts I did not have enough left for the stripes.

I cut some beech and mahogany for the stripes but they are too close in color. I thought the mahogany would stand out more.

First time I've used beech. My tools do not like it. Fairly hard but a lot of internal stresses. Kept grabbing at my table saw blade as I cut it causing even some smoke.

But super happy with the maple star inlays in the walnut. Labor intensive but results are excellent. My opinion is this technique will work with other shapes easily for more advanced inlay work.

[Dale]

That looks pretty impressive.

[gwhiz]

The stars look awesome!

[oscarl48]

Thanks guys. I am a little disappointed that I couldn't finish it this weekend. It would have been perfect for the fourth of July. But unfortunately because it is the fourth of July the base wood shop is closed. So hoping I can make it to the wood shop on Weds or Thurs to get the lumber I need.

[Mugsowner]

Very sharp Oscar, can't wait to see the rest.

[dbemus]

Outstanding work Oscar!! Looking forward to the finished project!

[mtylerfl]

The star inlays look fantastic! Excellent job!

I would have been tempted to apply regular (orange) shellac on the Mahogany and clear shellac (SealCoat) on everything else. That way, the contrast between the Beech and Mahogany might have been sufficient. If for use outdoors, I would then apply a clear outdoor finish overall.

ive had very good experience with Beech. But, as you know, internal stresses can be completely unpredictable from board-to-board in most any wood.

[oscarl48]

Michael, I was really, really tempted. I am concerned with bleed over using oil stains (I'm not too familiar with shellacs or stains really). I normally just either oil, poly or lacquer and let the wood shine.

Just gave me a chance to sit in front of the computer and do some modeling for patterns building ;).

[mtylerfl]

It's going to be gorgeous, whatever wood choice and finish you decide upon I'm sure.

Good to have the opportunity for some modeling time!

[PSQRD]

Michael, I was really, really tempted. I am concerned with bleed over using oil stains (I'm not too familiar with shellacs or stains really). I normally just either oil, poly or lacquer and let the wood shine.

Just gave me a chance to sit in front of the computer and do some modeling for patterns building ;).

Came out awesome Oscar! I would wipe down the mahogany and beech with a wet cloth. In my experience some mahogany tends to look dull before finish applies to where maple has almost matched but a gorgeous brown contrast once finish is applied

[cestout]

expensive, but how about pupal heart? Impressive job on the stars.
Clint

[cestout]

I am late getting into this conversation, but I have don inlays of 1/8 in flat material. Step 1 clear area with carved out area and 1/16 carving bit. 2. Flatten the edges with a 1/16" cutting bit 1/32 inset. 3. Copy and paste the shape and cut it out of gteh 1/8" inlay material with the1/16" cutting bit -1/32 inset.
Clint

[oscarl48]

Took way longer than it should have and I still haven't been to the wood shop. So decided to go with the African mahogany and maple I had already cut. The distinction is not as pronounced as I would have liked but better than I feared. I am sure with time the mahogany will get darker.

But overall really pleased. Now I have to figure out what I am going to do with it. I originally planned to hang it up like a picture frame on my military memorabilia wall with my shadowbox but it is heavy. It measures about 29" by 17".

Hope to see other folks attempt at doing this.

- O

[Mugsowner]

Oscar that looks ------- great. I wish I had the time to do one up myself, but life is not playing that way right now.

[mtylerfl]

Wow! Oscar, that looks really nice! I like the subtle contrast of woods and the star inlays are superb. Excellent work! Thank you for your inspiration.

[oscarl48]

Mugs, Michael, thanks.

Mugs, I hear you about the lack of time. It feels like I am rushing to slap these projects together instead of doing real carpentry. Normally I would have run each piece through the jointer and planer to ensure a perfect glue joint. Instead I just cut them and hand planed the big imperfections. I have a few less than perfect joints. They are hard to see but I know.

In the end it does look good so happy. Oh and the light stripes are beech and not maple. The stars are maple. So black walnut, maple, African mahogany, and beech.

I would love to see what folks are doing with inlay techniques.

- O

[n5jbd]

This is what I've been looking for, I've been making my flags using a hand held Dremmel tool. I tried to down load your file however i'm getting a unable to open, written by a newer version of the software. I'm running 1.880 what was this written in?
Thanks,
Terry