Deeper Centerline

[bergerud]

I am not a big sign maker who uses text much but, others have complained about not being able to make centerline deeper. For certain fonts or other angles of V bits, one might like to control the depth. If you have conforming vectors, you can make centerline cut deeper. It is not an elegant solution but it works.

It is simple. Type your centerline text. Copy and paste it on top of itself. Change one copy to inverted raster at a shallow depth. Choose conform for the centerline.

One does not actually have to carve the raster text. One could take out the carving bit and let it air carve.

In some situations, this might be useful.

[lynnfrwd]

Or...you could just use a thicker font...

[bergerud]

Or...you could just use a thicker font...

True, but this method allows for some tweaking of the font you have. It is WYSIWYG as opposed to altering bit lengths. If the project also has carve regions, it is no big deal to pre-carve for the centerline.

But besides all that, you know how I like tricks!!

[lynnfrwd]

Why create a complicated "trick" that might confuse people?

Some people on here are new and might think your way is the way to do it.

[bergerud]

I take your point but I do not know what else to say. I like to share tricks on the forum with others who might find them useful. This, for one, has been an ongoing subject. With all of the different kinds of fonts, centerline depth really should allow for some slight adjustments.

I will try to put my suggestions into better context in the future so new people will not be confused. (Just reading Bergerud's posts may void warranty. LOL)

[lynnfrwd]

Centerline calculates the middle of the font and the bit carves from one edge of the font to the other edge of font.
The further apart the edges, the deeper it has to go for the structure of the bit to meet both edges.
The closer the edges, the shallower it has to go for the structure of the bit to meet both edges.

How do you "set a depth" and still stay within the edges of a font without the structure of the bit blowing out the edges of that font?

In your own example, you did not keep the integrity of the font. You made it deeper and the bit "trespassed" the outline of the font.

[bergerud]

Thank you for explaining how centerline works to put this in context for new users.


To put the trick into context:

Fonts are made for printers. There are times when a printer font looks better carved at a slightly different depth.

Some more experienced users are using different shaped V bits and need to carve at deeper depths to get back to the font edges.

If I want to carve some text on a painted board, stain the text, and then plane it, I would want to initially carve the text deeper.

There are, I am sure, other reasons why an advanced user might want to tweak the depth of their centerline.

It is for these "out of the box" reasons that I think some may find the trick of use.

[rickroy]

I will be trying this trick. Thanks for posting. My method for skirting the problem inherent in Centerline Text has been to swap bits ... I use a short 60 V bit during the measuring stage of the project but use a bit that is about 1/16 longer for the actual carving. This has worked pretty well for me. I would appreciate a way to set the depth though.

[DickB]

Interesting trick. I think it is more trouble than it is worth, what with the air carve or extra raster carve. That said, I see how it could be useful for this: "If I want to carve some text on a painted board, stain the text, and then plane it, I would want to initially carve the text deeper."

Frankly I have never seen a problem with centerline, and in my opinion most people who want deeper centerline text don't really understand the mechanism. You can't carve deeper without carving wider when using a v bit. Centerline is brilliant at converting text stroke width into the correct depth and vectors to produce exactly that font's width with the 90 or 60 degree v bit. If you want deeper, go wider on the font, just like Connie said (and use the 60 rather than the 90 bit). No disrespect, but I do not agree with this statement at all: "...skirting the problem inherent in Centerline Text..." - to my way of thinking, there is no inherent problem with centerline text. It works brilliantly.

[fwharris]

And then there is, turn the font into a vector/dxf and then you can adjust the depth. Of course it is a bit more work.

[SteveNelson46]

I take your point but I do not know what else to say. I like to share tricks on the forum with others who might find them useful. This, for one, has been an ongoing subject. With all of the different kinds of fonts, centerline depth really should allow for some slight adjustments.

I will try to put my suggestions into better context in the future so new people will not be confused. (Just reading Bergerud's posts may void warranty. LOL)

Dan,

You're right. Forget about doing anything that is sophisticated, complicated or creative. Just keep it simple.

[DianMayfield]

Yup, if someone were to drill a quarter inch hole in the board side of the 4" end piece, and then have a variety of 1/4" plug heights for the bit - jog to touch, it shouldn't get out.

Someone should mention that you would need to run centerline and any carving as two projects.

[bergerud]

Someone should mention that you would need to run centerline and any carving as two projects.

The machine will do the raster first and then the centerline. I see no reason for two projects.

[DianMayfield]

I believe that the surface of the board is only found once, based on my observations.

[FWMiller]

Any time you try to fool the machine into doing deeper centerline you are going go distort the font. Getting good results would be a trial and error effort and highly dependent on the font. I've always gotten great results just switching to a 60 degree v bit and using bold font.

[bergerud]

I believe that the surface of the board is only found once, based on my observations.

You are right, but that does not mean one can only use one bit per project. When you use many bits on a project, one bit is picked to find the surface. The machine then knows the offset from the bit plate to the surface does not need to remeasure the surface for each other bit.

In fact, using a V bit by itself on a project is not as accurate as using a V bit with, say, the 1/8" cutting bit. The machine will use the cutting bit to find the surface because it is not sharp and better determines where the surface is.

I have done projects with as many as six different bits.

The order with which operations are done is important to know: Raster carve - vector paths - drills - cutouts - then edge routes

[bergerud]

Any time you try to fool the machine into doing deeper centerline you are going go distort the font. Getting good results would be a trial and error effort and highly dependent on the font. I've always gotten great results just switching to a 60 degree v bit and using bold font.

I agree. Centerline has worked well for me as also. I would like it to be smoother. Anyway, there are reasons why people might want to play with the depths and this is a way to do it.

[DianMayfield]

Dan, you are right as well. The two times I wanted the text to be nice and deep, it also had a carve area, which I did not want to be as deep as the text. I didn't have a good way to use height accurately to account for the change (decimal math challenged:)). Changing the size of the text wasn't good answer.

I came up with the hole idea when my bit hit between my rails on the side and the 4 inches at the end There was a half inch void where the two pieces didn't meet and darned if that isn't where the bit went for the surface touch. Small empty space but that darn bit found it and the whole thing was a quarter inch deeper than planned. Could see the point dent in the tape. Loved the effect on the text.

[zan29]

If I a project with text, I always turn the whole thing into a pattern and the text comes out much better!

[DianMayfield]

Suzanne, I haven't tried it. If your project has centerline text and a carving, and you turn it into a PTN, does the text still carve with the V bit?

[bergerud]

Suzanne, I haven't tried it. If your project has centerline text and a carving, and you turn it into a PTN, does the text still carve with the V bit?

If you convert centerline text to a pattern, it will be carved with the carving bit. You will lose some sharp edges, sharp valleys, and small details, and, it will also take a much longer time to cut.

[zan29]

Well Dan, normally when I convert to pattern it's because I'll be using the CNC instead and the raster text comes out a lot better, even the centerline. Of course it's all about what you're aiming for. Me I don't really care for the sharp valleys and small details, I just want nice text.

[bergerud]

Well Dan, normally when I convert to pattern it's because I'll be using the CNC instead and the raster text comes out a lot better, even the centerline. Of course it's all about what you're aiming for. Me I don't really care for the sharp valleys and small details, I just want nice text.

What about centerline type text on your CNC. Does it come out smoother than the centerline on the CW?

[jkammerer]

I found this topic because I am carving into a piece of reclaimed barn wood. I had to make a custom sled just so the machine would accept the piece. Its ever so slightly "cupped" in the middle...and I mean very little. But its just enough that some of the text doesn't come out as I thought or as it showed on the computer. Now I will have to go back carefully with a dremel and fill in some missing spots. Would be helpful if there were even just slight adjustments even specific to the text box highlighted. Something for carvewright to think about I guess.

**update**
To kind of cheat in a novice way, after the machine found the bit height and right before it started to carve, I opened the lid, loosened the bit, and lowered it the thickness of a zip tie. It helped out quite a bit. Not a perfect fix but if you are anticipating similar issues like I was having, maybe this would help.

[Dale]

I had the same problem with a design that had five paragraphs of text, one under the other and invariably the board would have a warp or cupping somewhere along the 25" of text that would leave some text very faint. I solved this problem by making five copies of the pattern and then on each copy delete all but one paragraph, a different one for each copy. Then I started with copy one and used "jog to position" to have the bit touch on the lowest point within that paragraph. When that finished carving I went to copy two and used "jog to position" for the lowest point of where the second paragraph would be. Continued that process for all five paragraphs. I used the original board that had the bad text on it to measure where each paragraph would be. It is a long process but it works pretty good, some text may be slightly deeper than others but it is much less noticable than text that is very faint.