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aokweld101
11-20-2014, 11:42 AM
I have this candy dish that it seems forever to figure out. I know that I have to import into the STL to splice into 2 pieces but my question is how do I get the image to look like a stl to splice ?

bergerud
11-20-2014, 12:17 PM
The CW software cannot do what you want to do. Sculptor and Pattern Editor cannot export "closed" surfaces. The only thing I think you could do is export the top and bottom separately and then "weld" them together in another 3d graphics program.

That being said, I do not think you really need to use a full 3d "closed" surface to get the end result you want. (I assume you just want to carve the dish in two halves. Two double sided slices.)

If you can post your two dish patterns as .png grey scales, I will play with how to do it. (File - Export to Image in the Pattern Editor)

aokweld101
11-20-2014, 05:28 PM
I just talked to LHR and as much as I don't want to, too do a STL you have to learn a third party software. It took two years to feel comfortable with the programs have.

lynnfrwd
11-20-2014, 05:58 PM
Aokweld, I'm real confused about what you are trying to do here.

You have the dish in an .mpc file & a .ptn? You want to recreate it in a 3rd party software to get it as an STL to slice and bring back into Designer and make it a .ptn?

Not sure why, but you could export it using Pattern Editor & STL Importer, then bring it in with STL Importer make it bigger and slice it.

cestout
11-21-2014, 04:32 PM
The problem, Connie, is that the inside and the outside are 2 different mpc/ptn files. To slice it, the 2 have the be combined into a 3D object the can be rotated and seen from both sides.
Clint

eelamb
11-21-2014, 05:15 PM
I guess I do not see the problem here. This looks like a 2 sided carve. Place one on one side of the board and the other on the other side. Center each pattern both ways and carve. Making sure you have the necessary 3.5+++ on each side of the pattern.
Are both patterns the same size?

aokweld101
11-21-2014, 06:28 PM
what Ed said sounds like it can be done that way... sometimes... the easiest solution is the hardest !.. what I'm having problems conceiving with this is the outside curve to the bowl.. and doing the cut out..

cestout
11-21-2014, 06:39 PM
Depends on how deep the bowl is. If no deeper than .8, a 2 sided carve will do with 1.187. If deeper then you will need 2 of newer and a long bit. He asked originally about slicing. Can only do that with a 3D object that you can rotate and see all views.
Clint

eelamb
11-21-2014, 10:12 PM
An item such as this would be a two sided carve. It wil be up to the person doing the carve to place manual tabs to hold the item in place while carving. I have found out this is one of my patterns. Therefore you nor anyone else can edit it, or use sculptor on it, let alone do anything using the STL importer. With that said I do believe I presented this pattern as a top and a bottom to be carved as I mentioned (two sided manual tabs),But I also believe I presented it with the STL 3d model so anyone could do with it as they choose. In this case I do not know if AOK is using the stl or the PTN files. If just the PTN files, then use it as 2 sided with manual tabs.
Cestout, the two will carve as shown. The top has a rounded edge, the bottom was sliced to the tip of the rounded edge. Therefore when carving both sides when it is cut from the board it will be a complete candy dish, with some sanding on the edges to make it perfect.
AOK there is no need for the cut path tool to be used. Manual tabs are required, no cut path, so no cutout.

eelamb
11-21-2014, 10:25 PM
Ok now that I know it was one I made, here is what I gave to those to down load.
#1 and MPC file with the candy bowl showing manual tabs, and 2 sided carve.
#2 PTN file of top and bottom (2 ptn files)
#3 to AOK only the stl file.
So everyone can carve this candy bowl for the holidays here is the mpc file in 1.187

Bigtyme
11-22-2014, 08:11 AM
Thanks for sharing, Eddie. Super job, as usual.

bergerud
11-22-2014, 11:29 AM
Sorry, but I think you guys are sort of missing the point. Aok wanted to make a 1.5" thick candy dish using the standard 1/16" carving bit. His problem is how to get from his mpc on a 1.5" thick board sliced into mpc's on two 0.75" boards. Using the STL importer is one way to do it, but, it is a bit tricky. I think it is easier just to make the two parts in Designer.

I think he is looking for a result more like:

(Edit: I made these in 1.187 and so one has to turn off the floor feather if opening the bottom in newer versions.)

eelamb
11-22-2014, 11:39 AM
Dan he is trying to use the stl file I sent him to recreate the two patterns I gave him as well as the MPC file. Nothing is 1.5" thick.
AOK to answer your question, I imported the candy dish, did a full one piece slice of the top, saved it. Then imported the candy dish again flipped it on the back and did the bottom slice. Now you have a top and bottom of the dish for carving a 2 sided carve.

ALso Dan did you recreate the candy bowl? Or did you use LHR software to modify the one I made then post it? Later is NOT GOOD!

bergerud
11-22-2014, 11:49 AM
We have been here before! It was a different thread:

http://forum.carvewright.com/showthread.php?26362-Importing-STL-quot-s&p=235873#post235873

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 11:56 AM
Dan, you understand what I was trying to do I am just not comprehending in my mind on how to do it, I was not trying to get you gentlemen upset I'm just trying to understand.. Thank you guys for the help.!

SteveNelson46
11-22-2014, 12:09 PM
It's like the carpenter that said "I want to cut this board in half but, I don't have a saw. Are there any workarounds?" You need version 3 and the long bits. Not trying to be insensitive. Just a recommendation for the right tools for the job.

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 12:17 PM
Hi Steve, thank you for your input, I don't have the 3.0 but just curious.. wouldn't the 2.07 work because it would still use the long bit ?

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 12:24 PM
Or did you use LHR software to modify the one I made then post it? Later is NOT GOOD!

What is the difference? This is not like a copywrighted design its all over the internet, templates in rockler, books going back to the 1950,s. Where did you get the STL? I often wonder how people go on the internet get someone elses stl, dxf's, jpg's etc. make a pattern or mpc and think that they now have creative license. Unless you designed a new design totally from scratch then you really cant claim ownership. Heck a lot of patterns in the CW pattern store can be traced to artwork and images on the internet or in stores. Yet persons scanned them or made patterns from artwork that are not original and now have licensed them for sale in the pattern store. No one checks on copyright issues or anything.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 12:28 PM
It's like the carpenter that said "I want to cut this board in half but, I don't have a saw. Are there any workarounds?" You need version 3 and the long bits. Not trying to be insensitive. Just a recommendation for the right tools for the job.

I like Dans solution as it does not involve buying a $300 program to carve a $2.00 candy dish. In fact I think Dans would be cool with two tops and one bottom, the center being a contrasting wood.

bergerud
11-22-2014, 12:37 PM
I regard this as more of an academic question. Is there a way to do it? It may not be the best way to do it in this case, but, there could be other cases where it would be useful. Suppose you make something in Designer using the 3d tools and want to scale it up to, say, a 4" thick object. How can one loop around through the stl importer to create slices? With Sculptor also importing and exporting between patterns and stl, this could turn out to be a useful technique.



ALso Dan did you recreate the candy bowl? Or did you use LHR software to modify the one I made then post it? Later is NOT GOOD!

Of course I made my own.

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 01:38 PM
Maybe I need to start on something easier. I don't understand how you went to get the two separate .75 boards so if I wanted to make it 1.5 thick out of the drawing I am posting now how would I do it to make it two boards I did the project board 7.2 x 7.2 x 1.5 . I made the pattern smaller so I could put it on the forum.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 01:47 PM
on dishes and bowls like this why not just use a 3/8 or 1/4 inch straight bit and cut them like pockets then cut out the outsides using a simple cut out then route the edges either with the cw or a router/router table. Using a carving patterns seems like a long and arduous process for a simple dish with no decorative carvings incorporated.

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 01:53 PM
it's not the matter of how decorated it is right now it's learning how to do it so you can add the decorated stuff later...

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 02:00 PM
it's not the matter of how decorated it is right now it's learning how to do it so you can add the decorated stuff later...

Look forward to seeing it.

bergerud
11-22-2014, 04:10 PM
Here is what I did to split the bowl into two slices: (Actually I used my own bowl which was 3" in diameter and 1.5 deep so as to make two 0.75 slices.)

1. Create pattern
2. Open pattern in PE
3. Invert
4. Export to STL
5. Next, Cut, Cut, Next
6. Flip both slices (Button with shell on it)
7. Browse to save location
8. Finish
9. Place slices on board
10. Invert slices, turn off floor feather

In the mpc (2.007), I put both the slices on the board as well as put the slices back together.

SteveNelson46
11-22-2014, 04:12 PM
Hi Steve, thank you for your input, I don't have the 3.0 but just curious.. wouldn't the 2.07 work because it would still use the long bit ?

I think so. There have been so many recent add-ons and releases I forget which will work with each version. I primarily work with version 3 and have to occasionally go back and review the timeline of releases to figure it out.

eelamb
11-22-2014, 06:20 PM
What is the difference? This is not like a copywrighted design its all over the internet, templates in rockler, books going back to the 1950,s. Where did you get the STL? I often wonder how people go on the internet get someone elses stl, dxf's, jpg's etc. make a pattern or mpc and think that they now have creative license. Unless you designed a new design totally from scratch then you really cant claim ownership. Heck a lot of patterns in the CW pattern store can be traced to artwork and images on the internet or in stores. Yet persons scanned them or made patterns from artwork that are not original and now have licensed them for sale in the pattern store. No one checks on copyright issues or anything.

I made this one, no image to look at no one else's design. image is of raw data file I created!
It was a point of asking if beta testers can modify our patterns, nothing to do with the actual pattern.

bergerud
11-22-2014, 06:36 PM
I just made one like I saw Aok had made in the earlier thread:

http://forum.carvewright.com/showthread.php?26362-Importing-STL-quot-s&p=235860#post235860

Just a few quick sweeps. In case anyone else wonders about beta software, we cannot even edit our own patterns with it.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 06:51 PM
For sale all over the place.
72976

jpaluck
11-22-2014, 06:56 PM
For sale all over the place.
72976


2D picture nothing to a 3d model..like apple to an orange

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 06:58 PM
2D picture nothing to a 3d model..like apple to an orange

In a lot of cases yes, In this case I can draw this in designer 1.87 and make it a pattern and have the exact same thing.

eelamb
11-22-2014, 07:07 PM
Thanks Dan.
HAL hmmmm never seen a pattern you have made before, how about showing us your skills.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 07:23 PM
When I first got on here there was all kinds of battles over ebay sellers, remember eelamb you accussed me of being someone else? When I saw all that I decided to keep my identity to myself and stay out of that mess. That's why I don't make patterns and post them here. I am not a 3d designer but I can do a lot with basic designer and PE as well as paint shop pro and AI to MPC. I don't feel the need to prove anything here I am just tired of the battles that is why I chimed in here to begin with. I still say that most patterns created even by the masters here come from web sites and other places and they are just adept at creating 3d from those pics, dxf's, STL's, depth maps, and traditional woodworking patterns that are out there. And then somehow the creators think that they can take someone elses work, make CW patterns and mpc's , and Yell at others for taking their work. Can you really say you have never seen a candy dish like that before you made one? My grandmother had one on her kitchen table 50 years ago. I am not trying to piss you off or be rude but sometimes people on here take too much credit and don't have the right to point fingers or yell at others. Lets face it you guys made the recently closed website just so it could be a more exclusive club away from here. I also feel the senior members only forum was created for the same reason. To separate the riff raff, and yes I am one of the riff raff. Ok, I am stepping off my soapbox. The opinions expressed in the previous post were not those of this forum, companies affiliated and maybe not even anyone else except me.

eelamb
11-22-2014, 07:30 PM
Hal nothing was mentioned about copyright, I asked a simple question which Dan has answered. You took it where it is at now. So show us what you can do.
If we took your view everything anyone has done, a tree, a brook, a picture taken of a field, these have all been seen and shown many times, what makes them different is how they were composed.
Hal you have a nice thanksgiving.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 07:32 PM
you too, Happy Thanksgiving.

CW-HAL9000
11-22-2014, 08:41 PM
Just for the hell of it here is a candy dish, made by me, which can be proved by the text that is part of the ptn itself. Made only on designer 1.87, no 3d or 2d tools or add ons not even Pattern editor. Made in 30 minutes or less.

7297972980

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 11:00 PM
Dan, I did what you said and somehow it doesn't look right...help!!!...lmao... I only done the top half but when I done the bottom it had a hole on the in all four centers.

bergerud
11-22-2014, 11:16 PM
Put a circle carve region over it with a height of 0.00. Apply clip exclusive to the circle. This should fill in the gaps between the sweeps. Now make the pattern including the circle. (I thought you were going to work on the simpler example!)

aokweld101
11-22-2014, 11:24 PM
well Dan.... I thought I had it under control, (guess not!!!) ..lol

bergerud
11-22-2014, 11:46 PM
The problem is only that there is a gap between the sweeps. You do not notice it on the board since the top of the board fills the gaps. When you make the pattern, the top of the board is not included in the pattern. You can fill the gaps by using a 0.00 height circular carve region. It fills the gaps but, it also fills the candy cavities. Apply menu: Carving - Clip Carving - Clip Carving Exclusive to the circle and presto, the cavities come back. Now save it all as a pattern and you should be good to go.

CW-HAL9000
11-23-2014, 02:24 PM
Here is my candy dish that I posted earlier without the name inserted in the ptn. The good thing about this one is you need no add ons and only designer 1.87 to use. It is set up for a 12x12 piece of 3/4 inch stock but because it is made with two seperate ptn files you can resize it with no problem. You can adjust depth to what ever thickness stock you use as well. You can use this however you want, sell it on ebay, give it your friends and enemy's, or put it in the trash bin of your computer. Happy Thanksgiving!

73002

SteveNelson46
11-23-2014, 04:23 PM
Here is my candy dish that I posted earlier without the name inserted in the ptn. The good thing about this one is you need no add ons and only designer 1.87 to use. It is set up for a 12x12 piece of 3/4 inch stock but because it is made with two seperate ptn files you can resize it with no problem. You can adjust depth to what ever thickness stock you use as well. You can use this however you want, sell it on ebay, give it your friends and enemy's, or put it in the trash bin of your computer. Happy Thanksgiving!

7300173002

Looks pretty good. Was the domed bottom in the upper right quadrant intended?

CW-HAL9000
11-23-2014, 05:02 PM
Looks pretty good. Was the domed bottom in the upper right quadrant intended?

opps, I was playing around with the domes and must have left it on. Don't know how I missed it but the whole thing was rushed. Thanks for pointing it out. Here is the corrected version.

aokweld101
11-23-2014, 05:21 PM
Dan, I got the front as I want it (per your instructions) But I have one last question ..If you slice it at .75 for two pieces and your sweeps for the four compartments are at a depth of 1".. the bottom slice does not show the four sweeps on the bottom board I'm hoping it is easy fix...and as all the drawing that people are showing I thank you for your input it's not that I don't appreciate you help it is the idea that I learn this for myself... so thanks to every one ..I was thinking maybe that I'm not using my working thinkness right.... when I think about it the board is sliced at .75 for two pieces so it's not showing the 1/4 depth sweep on the on the bottom board.

bergerud
11-23-2014, 05:54 PM
Did you forget about the invert? The problem is that when the STL importer slices, it caps the openings. You have to have it inverted first, slice, flip, and in the end, invert again. (I think, now I might be getting confused!)

aokweld101
11-23-2014, 06:23 PM
Dan..... I GOT IT !... I GOT IT !... YAHOOOO !... now only thing is how to put tabs on it. It's 1.5 thick all one piece..

bergerud
11-23-2014, 06:59 PM
I thought you wanted to do two 3/4" pieces. That was the reason for the slicing!

aokweld101
11-23-2014, 07:14 PM
After looking at it I wanted the four sweeps 1" deep and if I sliced it at .75 then my bottom board would not have the four sweeps that not would make the competed sweeps adding the .25 it was showing a flat board with the bottom curved.

bergerud
11-23-2014, 07:55 PM
You had to (with it inverted) slice 0.75 from the back! 0.25 from the front. I have done it. It can be done!

bergerud
11-23-2014, 08:58 PM
Here is what you should get. I put the both slices on one board for the screen capture.

I know you cannot give up!

Notice how there is less carving for the bit to do in the two layer method. Large pieces are removed instead of carved out.

aokweld101
11-24-2014, 12:02 PM
Dan, your last comment about me not given up.. made me laugh, but anyway... I know that you know what your doing or I wouldn't be asking. I did the STL slicing and somehow it didn't turn out anything like yours when I put the pattern on a .75 board I had the whole four sweeps through the board. Maybe by looing at what I come up with might help by what I'm doing.. showing on the snips is kinda what I thought it would look like. (before it came up.)

aokweld101
11-24-2014, 12:12 PM
I looked at what you snip is and after looking at it again the 1st one is the back and the second one is the front. I had something like that when I was play with the STL splicing. Now I have to figure that out again.... good motto to go by . >DON"T NEVER GIVE UP.

bergerud
11-24-2014, 12:29 PM
I do not know exactly what you did but it looks close to what I have. I think there is some floor feather and feather which needs to be turned off. I will play some more when I get home.

aokweld101
11-25-2014, 03:14 PM
Dan, I think I have what I was wanting been playing with it for the last day and half. But the last questions that I have is the cut outs.. on the first pattern the four sweeps, does that take the .75 depth all at once or a little or multiple passes... and can I do a regular cut out ? The second pattern is done from the backside and how do I do the cut out ?

aokweld101
11-25-2014, 03:27 PM
I put the file in a zip folder and low and behold it worked...

aokweld101
11-26-2014, 09:45 AM
Thought I would bump this to see if someone could help, I need to know how to put tabs on both patterns

bergerud
11-26-2014, 10:15 AM
Sorry Aok, I do not think your slices are right yet. Go back and look at post 12. There are tabs there as well as the sliced parts the way I think they should be.