x gears - presume teeth broken

[DianMayfield]

Ok, before this baby goes out with the bathwater.

Error e49-0331

Can I say how exceptionally annoying it is that there isn't a complete list of error codes -and if there is, how nice it got buried with all the other relevant things you can't find because there are too many words in your three word search.? God help anyone that buys this thing that is as mechanically inclined as my best friend - he can screw up anything.

With less than 200 hrs on the cut motor - Now the x gears appear to be out. When the machine went to measure a board, went about an inch and ground (yup, the sound too) to a halt.

Watched the video on cleaning or replacing the x gears. Simple enough.

So, the million dollar question, anyone have a cool idea on how to get the "adhesive" off of the existing cover (the video conveniently skipped that part) so the cover can be removed? 20 minutes with a razor knife and it is still firmly attached.

I'll sell the thing for $1400, just so you think twice about the thing. Want that one that the guy that does inlays has. Bet there is a bare minimum of moving parts on the thing, and obviously darned accurate!!!

[FWMiller]

The crunch of x gears is very distinctive. The x gear cover should come out if you pull up on it and squeeze in a little. The silicone adhesive just keeps dust out and shouldn't prevent you from removing it. It can be tough to get a good grip on it but it will come out. And yes, owning these machines isn't for those short on patience.

[DianMayfield]

Ah, apparently not always quite so simple. Now I owe my husband a $200 replacement pocket knife.

And in case inquiring minds want to know:

This morning was monthly PM day. Lubed all the verticals, removed bearing covers, cleaned & lubed rails, blew out pressure roller ends, measured head pressure at 85 lbs (it has never been below 83), 2nd 48 inch sled of the day. Now I get to spend $45 next daying a plastic gear that probably weighs 4 oz.

I have to say I am seriously questioning the wisdom of running 10 hrs and pending $100 each 10. Beyond discouraged. Not that I mind needing to be handy, because I have serious aptitude. This just smacks of poor quality, how much would it have cost to design a silicone gasket and trough. You can get plastic bowls with it for 2 bucks today.

[unitedcases]

Ah, apparently not always quite so simple. Now I owe my husband a $200 replacement pocket knife.

And in case inquiring minds want to know:

This morning was monthly PM day. Lubed all the verticals, removed bearing covers, cleaned & lubed rails, blew out pressure roller ends, measured head pressure at 85 lbs (it has never been below 83), 2nd 48 inch sled of the day. Now I get to spend $45 next daying a plastic gear that probably weighs 4 oz.

I have to say I am seriously questioning the wisdom of running 10 hrs and pending $100 each 10. Beyond discouraged. Not that I mind needing to be handy, because I have serious aptitude. This just smacks of poor quality, how much would it have cost to design a silicone gasket and trough. You can get plastic bowls with it for 2 bucks today.
I'll bite, so how heavy is your sled? And do you have dust collection?

[mtylerfl]

Ah, apparently not always quite so simple. Now I owe my husband a $200 replacement pocket knife.

And in case inquiring minds want to know:

This morning was monthly PM day. Lubed all the verticals, removed bearing covers, cleaned & lubed rails, blew out pressure roller ends, measured head pressure at 85 lbs (it has never been below 83), 2nd 48 inch sled of the day. Now I get to spend $45 next daying a plastic gear that probably weighs 4 oz.

I have to say I am seriously questioning the wisdom of running 10 hrs and pending $100 each 10. Beyond discouraged. Not that I mind needing to be handy, because I have serious aptitude. This just smacks of poor quality, how much would it have cost to design a silicone gasket and trough. You can get plastic bowls with it for 2 bucks today.

Hi,

I am so sorry to hear you're having problems. The X-gear breaking is actually a safety feature to prevent motor damage if a board mis-tracks through a machine. I know it doesn't feel that way to you right now, but it really did "protect" you. It is designed to fail on purpose if the board jams during tracking.

Accurate board tracking is easily achieved. I wrote an article awhile back specifically to help folks avoid tracking problems. I own two machines since 2007 and have never broken an X-gear, nor have I ever needed to replace an X-motor. So, it is possible to keep your machine tracking trouble-free, just as I have.

Here is a link to that article and I hope you will find it useful:

Maintaining Accurate Board Tracking – ISSUE 27 January – February 2010 (http://www.carvewright.com/assets/tips/CarveWrightTips_and_Tricks_Jan_Feb10.pdf)

[DianMayfield]

Michael,

I had your T&T open this morning when I re-lubed it, switched from grease to dry lube on the verticals per the recommendation. I know it's to protect the machine, and I do appreciate not needing to replace a motor instead! The frustration with having an owner maintained piece of equipment is that the various bits of information need to be organized in a way that makes it easy to locate. And it needs to be complete. Not finding that error code was beyond a pain in by backside. I manage the MMS (Maintenance Management System) at work, built it from the ground up. So I get it, and how important is all is.

I have rubber belts, I have a DC, the one from Irwin Products. I don't tighten the guide plate too much, learned that one early on. Two weeks ago I replaced the z bearings. I have broken 2 1/8th in bits since then (in less than 4 hrs of cutting) - the first broken bits in what I will estimate was 160 hrs. During the z bearing issue I became a masking tape convert - Thanks to Al. My sled is 48x1/2in MDF, and I cut bead board on it. I haven't weighed it, but not heavy. I have 8 outfeed rollers, 4 on each end, for longer pieces. I say all of this because when you do the right things, you should have that machine that runs for years with no major issues.

And having him break that stupid knife trying to get the cover off was just plain ridiculous. That's just poor design. There was gobs of that adhesive on there.

So, I don't know what caused that gear to protect my machine at that particular moment. It was the next 3 hours that really ratcheted up the frustration level.

[mtylerfl]

Hi Diane,

Again, I am very sorry you've had these problems. Sounds like you have done your homework - I imagine much more so than most people just starting out. I admire that in you. Breaking two bits that quickly is highly unusual. I've only broken two (or maybe three?) of those in almost EIGHT years! That is more normal.Often, premature bit breakage is caused by a mis-tracking board, board lift (not held under both rollers at all times), or 'bad' wood (board warp or cup during a project run).

Solid Carbide bits are very fragile to side pressure. if it gets "pinched" at all in a kerf, it will instantly snap. Wood can have hidden stress that you cannot see. I've seen that when cutting wood strips on my table saw before. A perfect-looking board can 'go wild' after cutting. The hidden stresses are relieved and it can bow or bend causing kickback, etc. Unfortunately, there is little that can be done about that - wood can be unpredictable at times.

My hope is that after you get over this hump, you will have put these problems behind you and get back to enjoying your machines as much as I have my own these almost eight years. We're a pretty helpful bunch around here, so you never have to go it alone. Please let us know if you need any help in the future.

[Digitalwoodshop]

Ouch... I know the pain of getting the little cover off... As posted above, the plastic x Gear is a safety that during a jam it will strip if the motor current monitor did not give you a X Stall. The thinking is that the plastic gear is the least expensive part not including Overnight Shipping. Years ago we talked about making it a brass gear.... but we quickly realized the error in our thinking. If we made it a brass gear then we would move the failure component up the food chain to the Servo Motor. The EXPENSIVE Servo Motor... or to the Servo Driver Transistor inside the CW computer... And the current fix for a blown servo driver inside the computer is replacement.... At about $300.00.... So a easily changable plastic X Gear is the best design. Now the plastic cover... that could have used a little more development time as it is hard to get off with the glue and dust can get inside and mess with the gears if you don't seal it up.


Now lets brainstorm WHY the gear broke.... Most times it is because of a jam... but you did not mention anything or an event at the time of failure. So likely from the other posts you have made about the broken bits in the past likely damaged the gear and fractured the teeth and it was just a matter of time before the teeth broke off.

On my "A" machines I have CUT AWAY some of the plastic on the frame of the machine that lets me remove the big plastic gear in front of the broken one just by pulling the "C" ring. I can change the gear quickly. It's been a while since I broke one but I am due... I was lucky I bought a few extras years ago to fix my machines that I borrowed gears from.

Good Luck,

AL

As a side note about that inlay video... Yes, it is a nice machine... and notice he used the "skin on the bottom" method of holding the loose parts and ran it through a thickness sander to release the parts. Further in the video when He removes a work piece you can see cut marks in the bed of his base board where he had his skin depth too deep and it cut through...

And back to your project of cutting the bead board... I would use 2 sided tape to hold the loose pieces and use vector lines and lie to the machine but use a Circuit board bit...

[mtylerfl]

What Inlay Video? I must have missed that post. Can you provide the link?

On our much more costly machines (i.e., more $ than the CW machine), we use a technique called V-Inlay - lots of folks use that method. I will see if that's what's in the video or something else, when I can visit the 'mystery link'.

[fwharris]

What Inlay Video? I must have missed that post. Can you provide the link?

On our much more costly machines (i.e., more $ than the CW machine), we use a technique called V-Inlay - lots of folks use that method. I will see if that's what's in the video or something else, when I can visit the 'mystery link'.

Michael,

That is what the video is about. A guy did one based off of the info from the Vectric forum.

[fwharris]

I think you have found the cause for your bad tracking on cut outs and the broken bits. The X gears were going bad and then finally gave out during your last project start up.

It also sounds like you have been doing a good job of machine maintenance and care.

[Digitalwoodshop]

What Inlay Video? I must have missed that post. Can you provide the link?

On our much more costly machines (i.e., more $ than the CW machine), we use a technique called V-Inlay - lots of folks use that method. I will see if that's what's in the video or something else, when I can visit the 'mystery link'.

From the inlay post here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIGeCdDPz0I

Sorry... got off track but it was related to "Methods of CW Use"....
AL

[mtylerfl]

Thank you for the link. That particular video is not the V-Inlay technique, but is the more conventional "pocket" inlay method. Nothing wrong with that, and is fine for what the fellow did in the video. The V-Inlay method can render much, much finer detail than the pocket inlay technique and has become rather popular for those cases.

The pocket technique will always have rounded internal corners due to the geometry of the bit. A V-Inlay can have sharp internal corners and cut finer detail. The drawback to V-Inlay is it does waste a lot more wood that the conventional pocket inlay. So, V-Inlay is only used when necessary for a finely detailed design.

I could not tell what machine the guy was using, but it likely costs thousand$ more than our CarveWright machines. (The ShopBot machine in my shop has a retail of about $18,000.)

[CW-HAL9000]

Here is a CNC v-carve inlay Technic I have been wanting to try since it came out in 2011. I just have it on the backburner and have not gotten around to it. I think it could work with the carvewright.

http://www.americanwoodworker.com/blogs/randyjohnson/archive/2011/09/01/cnc-v-carve-inlay.aspx

[mtylerfl]

Here is a CNC v-carve inlay Technic I have been wanting to try since it came out in 2011. I just have it on the backburner and have not gotten around to it. I think it could work with the carvewright.

http://www.americanwoodworker.com/blogs/randyjohnson/archive/2011/09/01/cnc-v-carve-inlay.aspx

Yes, that is the V-Inlay technique that I mentioned. Randy J. did an excellent article about this method in the 2011 magazine. The technique was originally developed by a couple fellows...Paul Zank and Damien Durrant back in 2006.