PDA

View Full Version : Flexshaft outer sheath disintegrated



rflournoy
07-18-2014, 07:12 PM
My machine has less than 15 hrs on it and flexshaft outer sheath just disintegrated in the middle of a project. Anyone else ever had this? What did you do to remedy it? Thanks.

fwharris
07-18-2014, 07:39 PM
Looks almost as bad as mine when I first started carving. Was this a new machine?

I did notice what appears to be twist ties around the outer core and the guide wire, am I right? If so that might have added to the over heating as they would prevent the free movement of the guide wire and flex shaft.

rflournoy
07-18-2014, 08:38 PM
Yes, brand new, bought it last year after Christmas, but haven't been able to use it until this summer. I believe the twist ties were on from the factory, but wouldn't swear to it. I didn't put them on.

lynnfrwd
07-18-2014, 09:34 PM
Friction, not fully engaged or lack of lubricant. :(

rflournoy
07-18-2014, 09:41 PM
Shouldn't have been lack of lubrication...it is practically unused at less than 15 hrs.

fwharris
07-18-2014, 09:44 PM
Yes, brand new, bought it last year after Christmas, but haven't been able to use it until this summer. I believe the twist ties were on from the factory, but wouldn't swear to it. I didn't put them on.

The twist ties should always be removed as like I said they restrict the movement plus seem to add a not spot. I do have one twist tie on mine but it is very loose around the outer core. It just helps keep the end of the flex wire in line with the outer core. See attached.
If the machine had been sitting that long the lube probably dried out. When you order a new flex shaft make sure you order some lube if you do not already have some. Also pick up a small infra read thermometer to monitor the temp. Harbor freight has a small one for around $10.00.

rflournoy
07-19-2014, 05:10 AM
Thanks for info. I ordered a new flexshaft last night but didn't see your post until afterward. Is there a suitable substitute available that I can get locally?

fwharris
07-19-2014, 10:22 AM
I use Crane Cam Lube with Molly, an automotive pre assembly lube. It is more of a paste, not in a spray can, that you apply with your fingers. I got it by going to a local auto shop that does engine rebuilds. They ordered it from their supplier and had it to me the next day. You can also order it on line. Very few if any auto supply shops have it in stock but might be able order it to.

Just make sure you stay away from the liquid wrench chain lube with molly. That used to be the go to lube but they changed the formulation so it is no longer an effective lube for the CarveWright.

Digitalwoodshop
07-19-2014, 10:25 AM
When that happened to me, I had kinked the internal spring and the rubbing heat built up and made the outer rubber start to melt and the smoke set off my smoke detector.... And as a public service reminder, everyone should have a smoke detector above the CW... A cheap $9.00 or less investment....

AL

scootertrash
07-21-2014, 04:54 PM
Shouldn't have been lack of lubrication...it is practically unused at less than 15 hrs.

I had a very similar problem with a machine with very low hours. Bought my machine a few months after yours.

Dang shaft was always running hot. I lubed it once, let it dry properly, and it got worse. Painfully hot. Then I wiped it down again, lubed it again, let it dry for two days (meant to be overnight but I was busy), and then pulled the spring out and wiped the heck out of it from end to end. Next thing you know it runs at a barely warm temperature.

If it's too hot to hold onto for 5 seconds it is running waaaaay too hot. I check mine about every 15-30 minutes.

Also, According to LHR you do NOT need to lube a new flex shaft. After my experience with mine I might consider it when I use the flex shaft I bought in case the original a-sploded like yours.

cestout
07-23-2014, 03:38 PM
I said this today in another post: I have had 3 A machines then a B and added a C and have NEVER had shaft heating problems. After the 3rd lube with Lubraplate 930AA they barely even get warm.
Clint

rflournoy
08-12-2014, 02:00 PM
I've had the new flexshaft installed for three weeks now and it melted. All the instructions online were followed, but the shaft started running hot after the first week. Sometime in the second week it started whining like a dry bearing so I took out the core and lubed it--following the instructional video. It worked great, no whining, no overheating, but Thursday night I went out to change the bit only to discover the outer sheath was melted and smoking. I contacted LHR to see if the new flexshaft was under warranty only to be told that the second malfunction was my fault. I sent an e-mail detailing how I installed the new shaft and no response (it's been three business days). Yesterday I left a nasty note on their Facebook page, but no response.
Now my questions: Have we been duped into believing the LHR is a reputable company that will take care of its customers? Did I buy a Carvewright, all the bits, all the accessories except third-party stuff, and waste all that money? If I've wasted my money on a Carvewright boat anchor I'll be sure that all my woodworking friends don't make a similar mistake.

rflournoy
08-12-2014, 02:01 PM
I used the stuff LHR sells to make sure that the warranty isn't voided. That was the wrong thing to do...no warranty on a new flexshaft.

lynnfrwd
08-12-2014, 02:29 PM
Mr. Flournoy:

You sent an email Thursday night at 8:41 PM, I responded to you by 10:00 AM the next morning. Your replied to me at 1:43 PM that Friday afternoon and I responded to you at 2:37 PM. All four of these exchanges are on the same email, so I'm not sure what you mean by saying you've gone 3 days without a response. You have also stated that you have lubricated that flexshaft two times already, since you received it (already newly lubricated). I've asked you to check the top hat for excess oil in your bearing and warned that over-lubrication can be just as bad as none. You might can order another flexshaft, but my guess is it will melt too until we address the possibility of over-lubrication.

As for your "nasty note" on Facebook, that is a site where we promote the machine and as the owners of the page, have the right to monitor it's contents. Any troubleshooting issues can be dealt with in the forum or via email.

I understand you are frustrated with having melted another one, but you CANNOT just throw more lubricant at any flexshaft issue. Clearly from the troubleshooting steps online, lubricating is one of the last options.

lynnfrwd
08-12-2014, 02:45 PM
Your machine was purchased Jan 2013 and I understand you may have a very good reason for not using it for 1.5 years, but the flexshaft may have needed to be lubricated after sitting for so long and why it melted.

This second one has me concerned that it has now been lubricated 3 times. I have no way of knowing exactly why it melted. The spring could have been pitched one of the times it was taken out or put back in. One end may have not been fully engaged when you put it back in the last time.

I also need to remind you and others, do not leave the machine carving for 10 hours or even 1 hour. You need to monitor it.

rflournoy
08-12-2014, 03:07 PM
I'm not sure why you think I lubricated the shaft three times. If you read my e-mail it says "I checked" not "I lubricated" when I received it. Then after it started whining I lubricated it. This was after I made sure it was properly installed and everything was as it should have been.
As for the e-mails, I responded to your last e-mail on 8 Aug to tell you that there was no oil in the top hat and have received no response.
Since I went all-in when I bought the Carvewright, i.e. bought all the software, all the bits including the router bits, and now the rotary jig, I was hoping that you would see fit to warranty the second flexshaft rather than forcing me to buy a third one.

lynnfrwd
08-12-2014, 03:21 PM
I never received another email after the one at 1:43 PM.

I did not mean YOU lubricated three times. LHR lubricated before shipping and from your statement of "including making sure the core was lubricated" led me to believe you re-lubricated it and then lubricated it, again prior to the last carve. LHR once, you twice - three times.

I would love to be able to tell you EXACTLY why it melted, so that we can avoid it in the future. However, I can only speculate from what you have told me.

The flexshaft is not a warranted item.

ronboley
08-14-2014, 06:50 PM
FYI...I posted this under "Flex Shaft Melt Down" maybe two years ago(?) and others subsequently have posted the same issue...Same problem...outer sheath melted right off of the flex shaft, disassembled it, lubed it and put it back together....mine has been working well and cool since...about 100+ hours with 2-3 lubes and no further problem...my new flex shaft sits on the shelf and stands by should I ever need it. Is it possible the plastic sheath is the problem???

Just my 2c worth.

lynnfrwd
08-14-2014, 07:03 PM
After 2 years, make sure you lube it before using.

sunmiztres
11-07-2014, 05:22 PM
I too am having the same problem. I had a flexshaft that melted all the plastic off. Never had a problem with 25 plus hours. I then bought a new one, installed it and after 2 hours the thing gets extremely hot right in the middle of the shaft. Right where the wire bends. IT is a brand spanking new Flexshaft so it should not need to be lubed but I also bought the lube for it from Carvewright when I bought the flexshaft so I gave it a good lube and let it drip over night and the same thing happens. Within a couple minutes the middle gets so hot that it begins to melt the plastic covering. Only in the middle. I did the troubleshooting for this problem by following the troubleshooting tips for over heated or melted flexshafts but it still persists. I need to find out why it is happening because I can't shell out another 75$ for another new one. Any help would be much appreciated. Thank You

bergerud
11-07-2014, 07:21 PM
One of the main things is to make sure of is that the core is free floating. Make sure each end slides easily into the square holes. Sometimes the motor end needs a clean out.

Digitalwoodshop
11-07-2014, 07:21 PM
I too am having the same problem. I had a flexshaft that melted all the plastic off. Never had a problem with 25 plus hours. I then bought a new one, installed it and after 2 hours the thing gets extremely hot right in the middle of the shaft. Right where the wire bends. IT is a brand spanking new Flexshaft so it should not need to be lubed but I also bought the lube for it from Carvewright when I bought the flexshaft so I gave it a good lube and let it drip over night and the same thing happens. Within a couple minutes the middle gets so hot that it begins to melt the plastic covering. Only in the middle. I did the troubleshooting for this problem by following the troubleshooting tips for over heated or melted flexshafts but it still persists. I need to find out why it is happening because I can't shell out another 75$ for another new one. Any help would be much appreciated. Thank You

WOW.... That is not good... I am at a loss to suggest something to help... IS the cut motor cutting in the correct direction? Hold a bit between your fingers and rotate it and feel the way that chips are pulled up and out of the board. Then observe the bit with the motor starting and stopping is the motor turning the correct way.... Just a WAG... Wild AL Guess...

AL

sunmiztres
11-10-2014, 11:49 PM
WOW.... That is not good... I am at a loss to suggest something to help... IS the cut motor cutting in the correct direction? Hold a bit between your fingers and rotate it and feel the way that chips are pulled up and out of the board. Then observe the bit with the motor starting and stopping is the motor turning the correct way.... Just a WAG... Wild AL Guess...

AL
The core is free floating from what I can feel by inserting andmoving the core. Never have a problem inserting it into the ends. The only thing I can think of is the core is grinding in the middle where the shaft gets so hot that it wants to melt the rubber. IS it metal on metal in the shaft that the core can move to the point it hits metal and grind? Of course I can't hear it grind since the motor is loud. If the core is somehow hitting the metal in the middle where it gets hot do you think adding any tape or certain grease will keep the friction down to avoid getting so hot? I still wish I knew why it started to begin with. Since it is a new flex shaft I am thinking the problem must be elsewhere but have gone through the troubleshooting for why it may be happening and everything looks right.

bergerud
11-11-2014, 12:45 AM
Have you tried flipping the core end for end? I am thinking that even though you say it is free floating, maybe one of the ends "creeps" out of its slot under the torque and vibration. That is, maybe the core gets compressed when it spins up. If there was, for example, a slight twist in one end, it might ride up the slot. Flipping it might fix it. (Just something easy to try.)

I think that there is a mystery here as to why some flexes heat up and others run cool. I wish I had a bad one to experiment with.

CW-HAL9000
11-11-2014, 04:45 PM
Have you inspected the spring inside the flexshaft. There has been no mention of it. It does have one correct? Is it straight and not warped or bent?

sunmiztres
11-13-2014, 12:19 PM
The spring looks great. No bend or warping which makes it even more weird since the core gets so hot to melt the rubber but no heat markings on the spring which is right next to the core.

sunmiztres
11-13-2014, 12:22 PM
Have you inspected the spring inside the flexshaft. There has been no mention of it. It does have one correct? Is it straight and not warped or bent?
I did try to change the core end for end but can't get the end that is in the spindle to engage in the motor. I will give that a shot again. Might be where the problem lies if both ends are suppose to go in both sides easily.

CW-HAL9000
11-13-2014, 01:51 PM
Sometimes you have to turn it a little to get it to engage but it should go in fairly easy. You may need to inspect the end of your flex shaft and see if it has been worn or rounded off. And you may need to inspect the female end into the motor and see if it is worn or rounded off as well. This could easily be your problem. If the flex shaft is not fully inserted into either end it makes the shaft longer with in the sheath then it is supposed to be and creates heat in the center.

sunmiztres
11-15-2014, 08:25 AM
Sometimes you have to turn it a little to get it to engage but it should go in fairly easy. You may need to inspect the end of your flex shaft and see if it has been worn or rounded off. And you may need to inspect the female end into the motor and see if it is worn or rounded off as well. This could easily be your problem. If the flex shaft is not fully inserted into either end it makes the shaft longer with in the sheath then it is supposed to be and creates heat in the center.I did this again and it went in fairly easy. I did a 45 minute carve and the middle was the hottest part but not to the point of melting. How hot is normal. I have noticed when I put a decorative edge to the piece that is when the core gets the hottest.Still feel as though it is not "right" Feel like I need to be there when carving all the time to make sure a fire does not start or another ruined flex-shaft.

lynnfrwd
11-15-2014, 09:40 AM
We suggest you do NOT leave machine unattended while it's running.

CW-HAL9000
11-15-2014, 12:22 PM
On 6 ,7 or 10 hour carves its just not possible, heck on 2 hour carves I can't stay in the shop watching it. Some people put a smoke detector in the shop to help alert when there is a problem. Some even put baby monitors. As far as how hot. It seems to average about 85 degrees. You can get a cheap infrared thermometer from harbor freight. However, most just touch it and can tell when its getting too hot.

widget223
08-09-2020, 08:17 PM
On 6 ,7 or 10 hour carves its just not possible, heck on 2 hour carves I can't stay in the shop watching it. Some people put a smoke detector in the shop to help alert when there is a problem. Some even put baby monitors. As far as how hot. It seems to average about 85 degrees. You can get a cheap infrared thermometer from harbor freight. However, most just touch it and can tell when its getting too hot.


6 hour carve!!??? There is no way this machine will last long enough to get a 6 hour carve. I have to baby the heck out of mine to get one hour from it. I have to stop it every 15 min to clear the dust or I get a failure. The second to last carve I went upstairs to have a snack and it sounded as if it was very bogged down. By the time I got back down to it, the board was on fire with a y-axis stall message. I cleaned everything up put in a new bit ($45) and a new board ($10). At 15 minuets everything seemed ok. Then when I resumed the carve after a vacuum the flexshaft was making noise and getting hot. Rather than stop the carve I paused every few min to let the shaft cool. So now it looks like I need a new flexshaft ($90). Will try to lube it first but reading everything here I will need a spare for it even if lubing does save it temporarily. So my one hour carve cost me $145 in parts.

Dale
08-09-2020, 08:57 PM
What are you using to lube the shaft? I use the stuff LHR sells and it has been well over 200 hours since I last lubed it and it just barely gets warm. It sound like you do not have a dust collector? That is a must for this machine I don't think it is causing your flex shaft problem but it will definitely cause a host of others.

fwharris
08-10-2020, 11:37 AM
6 hour carve!!??? There is no way this machine will last long enough to get a 6 hour carve. I have to baby the heck out of mine to get one hour from it. I have to stop it every 15 min to clear the dust or I get a failure. The second to last carve I went upstairs to have a snack and it sounded as if it was very bogged down. By the time I got back down to it, the board was on fire with a y-axis stall message. I cleaned everything up put in a new bit ($45) and a new board ($10). At 15 minuets everything seemed ok. Then when I resumed the carve after a vacuum the flexshaft was making noise and getting hot. Rather than stop the carve I paused every few min to let the shaft cool. So now it looks like I need a new flexshaft ($90). Will try to lube it first but reading everything here I will need a spare for it even if lubing does save it temporarily. So my one hour carve cost me $145 in parts.

6 hour carves are a walk in the park if you have dust collection set up.

Mugsowner
08-10-2020, 05:03 PM
I have a pvc tube that has a cap glued on one end and another fit loose on the other end. I put the flex shaft in the tube, fill with lube, cap, and let it sit over night. I also have a magnet made up with a hook on it the remove the flex shaft from the tube and hang it to dry. Works great, shaft stays well lubed. I do long time carves all the time and all works well.

lynnfrwd
08-10-2020, 05:33 PM
I always suggest an old plastic coffee container with lid. That way the flexshaft is curled. Important because it is a penetrating lubricant. The curve allows the lubricant to get inside the core. Then you just put the lid on the coffee container and reuse later.

lynnfrwd
08-10-2020, 05:39 PM
6 hour carve!!??? There is no way this machine will last long enough to get a 6 hour carve. I have to baby the heck out of mine to get one hour from it. I have to stop it every 15 min to clear the dust or I get a failure. The second to last carve I went upstairs to have a snack and it sounded as if it was very bogged down. By the time I got back down to it, the board was on fire with a y-axis stall message. I cleaned everything up put in a new bit ($45) and a new board ($10). At 15 minuets everything seemed ok. Then when I resumed the carve after a vacuum the flexshaft was making noise and getting hot. Rather than stop the carve I paused every few min to let the shaft cool. So now it looks like I need a new flexshaft ($90). Will try to lube it first but reading everything here I will need a spare for it even if lubing does save it temporarily. So my one hour carve cost me $145 in parts.

6 hour carves absolutely are possible.
Dust collection!
No vacuuming during a carve!
New flexshaft comes pre-lubricated.