Sawdust Removal

[BobHill]

As previously stated, I recently got the JET DC1100C RC dust collector (it's huge) with suction enough to never have pets or small wives walk in front of when in full power. I attached that to the rear exhaust port with a tight fitting vacuum hose size reducer (the 4" to 2½" fits perfectly when you remove the cloth filter section).

RESULTS: Nada, zip, zero in removing sawdust while machine is working. I thought perhaps the breathing fin holes above might have been deflecting the suction, but nope. blocking those (plastic wrap) didn't change a thing. It's just the wrong place to put any type of vacuum and expect it to clear ANY sawdust from the work area. And I haven't tried the bottom yet, but I'm afraid that it'll do a little, but won't clear the top sawdust all that much either. Thus, it's either the side (right) and best, the top through the clear plastic that would be the best. Actually (hint hint) an attachment for something like a very flexible 1¼" hose onto the Z truck would be best, if it wouldn't hurt the action of the truck. That way the sawdust would clearly be removed as the bit would creat it.

That's what I'm finding, anyway. I just made one of the biggest collection of sawdust ever (doing a ½" depth on a ¾" board) and that took four separate opening to clear it out during the carving process. for this I used my much smaller Shop Vac. It would have been great if the JET could have been attached to do the job.

Bob Hill
Tampa Florida

[pkunk]

Through the right side doesn't work, if you look theres the right side of the carriage blocking a path.

[BobHill]

Didn't you go through the right side, Pkunk?

Bob

[pkunk]

Yes, but wish I hadn't. On a really thick piece it helps some, but the bottom suction is the best I've tried. I do have more suction than most at 1800cfm.

[BobHill]

Pkunk,

By using the bottom suck, how much sawdust does it remove that gathers on the top? That's where most of the problem area is, of course. I forget who now, that did it through the plastic cover, but for all I wouldn't like to do it there, I'm still thinking that's the best so far.

Bob

[pkunk]

There is still dust left on the surface but hardly any anywhere else in the machine. The shelf under the cover will get a half teaspoon.

[BobHill]

That's cheap enough for me to give it a try, Pkunk.

Bob

[Kurtsara]

There is still dust left on the surface but hardly any anywhere else in the machine. The shelf under the cover will get a half teaspoon.

My dust collector is not as big as yours, I do get some left on the shelf under the clear cover also

[The Bard]

that machine is too clean to be a working model...

I say Fake!

[Cliff]

I'm looking to do something like Kurt. I've got a folding workmate and will remove the center top section and replace it with a board with a slot cut in it. I'm still looking for dust collector parts such as a 'y' connector as I want to use the exhust port as well as the bottom. Currently it take me about 30 minutes to do a cleanup and wipe down after a project, and they're only short 60 minute test projects. The machine is far better at carving the project than I am at designing it.

[Digitalwoodshop]

Kurt,

I like your setup, like plunk did I believe. Started on my dust collector prototype. I will do the bottom slot plus go with this contraption on top. I will cut the plastic door some. It will go full width when for real, this size just fit in my metal shear for ease cutting the prototype. I will make a sled to cut the bigger pieces of copper on my table saw. With this design I am using the sloped area as a intake for chips. The extended piece lets the chips in but if I put a bigger bit on it should work. I will hit the store Monday for some supplies and get back to it.

I plan to cut the plastic door just below where it hits on the left and right and a rectangular box will connect the inside collector and the outside and a 4 inch hose.

I will solder the real one for suport. This is Copper Circuit Board Material, Fiberglass inside.

AL

[Digitalwoodshop]

I went off in a different direction today with the top duct collector port. Decided to give the dryer vent a try. This vent is a No. 143 W Under Eave Vent - White 0 39899 80143 6 Manufactured by Lambrd. Then I used a 4 inch to Rain Gutter Downspout adaptor. Will work on it more when the RTV dries.

The Z does clear but I will cut it back another 1/2 inch and make a quick release to remove it. Will notch the cover.

If I get a static problem I will go back to copper.

AL

Clipped the plastic so the front flat part is even with the black metal of the Carve Machine.

[Kenm810]

Hi All

I’ve been puttering around my studio while waiting for my carving bits to arrive, and after reading some of the input to the forum. I thought I’d try my hand at building a down draft table.
We had some Heating guys replacing a heating & cooling unit, in one of shops. So I asked if they had any used furnace blowers I could buy, their head man said sure they get them all the time 2, 3, 4, a week. He told me he had one on his truck I could have right then. I offered to pay for it. He said don’t worry about it - they just throw them in the dumpster any way. 10 or 15 minutes later one of the younger heating guys brought in a 3 speed twin squirrel cage blower with its mounting brackets and wire harness. I gave him$20.00 for carrying it in, and told him to buy the guys some coffee. He said if I had any Problems with it just call they’d drop of another.
I mounted it in a three section table that I made from scrap 5/8” plywood with 2 five micron reusable filters between the input and output vents. I added a couple of forced air tubes on either side of front roller table to give the air a little boost through the machine. The rest of the air is vented out the side of the table. I’ve been running it at mid range about 800 cfm. The unit is very quite compared to vacuums on the saws or the negative pressure systems in the shops. It’s not even ¼ as load as a shop vac. I also found that 1 ½” SC 40 PVC fittings are 2 ¼” O.D. and fit into the dust outlet after removing the dust bag. I now vent it directly into down draft table. I mounted to the whole thing on 4” lockable wheels to move it around. Just to be on the safe side I added a static ground wire system through a 1meg ohm resistor to ground. I also have a small $15.00 hand Vac that I use for cleaning the corners in side the machine.

[Digitalwoodshop]

I Like IT !!!! Nice Shop too !!! :D

AL

[Gman_Ind]

The shop vac motors are brushed motors where the bigger fan motors are induction motors, much quieter to run. Less maintenance too.

[Kenm810]

Hi All

I’ve been watching this thread about dust in the machine and what might help to get rid of some of it. The other day while standing mesmerized by the carving bit moving
Side to side up and down, side to side up and down, side to si ---- anyway why not have
A little air move up and down with it. So I tried this- No tools to install. No modification of the machine. Less then $10 bucks in parts, Hobby shop for brass tubing, Hardware store for humidifier or ice maker valve, Pet store for ¼” vinyl tubing, or auto parts store
For 1/8”rubber vacuum tubing, Plug into air line or compressor 10 to15 lbs does the trick.
Remember it should be used with a dust collection system, or down draft table.
Now just stand there and watch the dust fly as the carving bit moves Side to side up and down, side to side up and - you get the idea.

[pkunk]

OK, here's the setup that I've been using. 2 - 4" into a 5" about 20 ft from a 3hp Grizzly cyclone. All metal except for a little bit of flex. I circled the area inside that the upper port is behind.

[Jeff_Birt]

I thought this may be a good place to move the discussion that pkunk and I were havingn last evening on Shoop-Vacs/dust collection units creatign static. I was purusing the dust collection at Grizzley tool today (god that store makes me drool) and noticed that they even have all there fittings labled as static safe (meaning it bleeds of the static charge), and they also sell a braded coppper grounding strap for the DC systems.

So I'm guessing that even with new hoses and fittings etc, if your Shop-Vac or DC is an older unit, built from materials that do not disipate static well (like my old, recycled by way of a friend Shop-Vac). Or, I goess you could have run the DC limes in your shop with materials that are not static safe. So, it seems that perhaps a grounding strap is in order.

[pkunk]

I don't have a static problem with the DC at all. Only with the old Sears vac.

[Jeff_Birt]

Just trying to find/provide some general inforamtion about shop-vac/DC static generation problems as realted to the MC. I'm guessing because your DC is set up to be static safe all the way it has never given you any problems. The shop-vac not so . It would be interesting to add a ground strap to you old shop vac hose and see if it quits shocking you.

[Bill]

Hello,
I can see where the DC removing all the dust/chips will save a lot of wear and tear on the machines
by looking at the pictures here and you see very little dust/chips on your machines and you look at
mine after one piece and it looks like it had never been cleaned but I do thourghly after every piece.
I do not think all this Dust/Chips,debris is good for the machine at all.

Excellent ideas, I need something like this.
Bill.

[Digitalwoodshop]

I like the hole in the side of the unit. I also like the air assist tube too. Pointing the air tube from the left side of the head to a hole cut in the right side looks like a good use of 2 ideas plus a down draft..... And static safe fittings and your all set.... The air tube sweeping the chips to the air intake.

Nice work !!!

AL

[Bill]

Paul,
How did your idea work with just the hole in the bottom? I guess I am
looking for something for myself not being a seasoned wood worker and
just a welder who does not have a DC such as yours. Would a good
shop vac. on the bottom like you have in your picture work well enough
to do the job?
Thanks Bill.

[Kenm810]

Hi All

I haven’t been able to fine it but one of threads said something about shedding a little light inside the machine. I’ve been fooling around with some high intensity LEDs, and Mag. Lights, And found the ones from 3 cell flash lights work well lighting up the inside of the machine.
They come in 4.5 volt dc 1, 2, 3, and 4 LED clusters, or two bulb pack long life Mag. Lights, which work very well with Radio shacks 4.5volt dc 110 volt ac adaptor. You can run them for several hours on a 3 cell battery pack using 1.5 volt double a, c, d, batteries. The LEDs can work up to10,000 hours and beyond on the ac - dc transformer adaptor, A little wire, a little solder, a little Velcro, a few parts and let there be light. It’s not meant to make the machine work any better, just helps to see what’s going on inside when I’m carving, cleaning out the dust and chips or changing Bits. I use the ac dc adaptor Myself. Just A thought - At least it works for me.

[jdrof]

I have been reading all the posts on dust collection and here is what I came up with.
Not wanting to raise the height of the machine anymore, I drilled a series of 3/4" holes (18 total) in a 2 1/4" W x 20" long strip in the center of my work bench. I then mounted a 3 sided box (2 3/4" W x 2 1/4" D x 21" L inside dimension) to the underside of the work bench, used a 2 1/2" outlet, ran it to the end of the bench where it increases to 4" and connects to my 650 cfm Jet collector.
I also added some air at the Y-Truck by means of 1/8" vinyl tubing back to a 30 cfm air brush compressor. Without the air brush jar on it, it has a constant flow of almost 10 psi.

Here are a few pictures. This is after a 35 min test run. Minimal dust.
We will see how it does on a larger project.

[pkunk]

30 cfm out of an airbrush compressor??:rolleyes: I need one of those. :cool: Thats about twice what I get from my shop compressor -6hp/60gal tank.

[jdrof]

Sorry---I ment 30 psi

[Kenm810]

Hi jdrof

Very nice set up and good photos, I know that little extra air moving around the carving bit really dose help. and your right 5 to 10 psi plenty .

[MrUserfriendly]

Hey JDROF,

What is the model number of your jet collector, and where do you get this brand? How expensive are they?

[jdrof]

MrUserfriendly,

It is a JET DC-650A, manufactured by WMH TOOL GROUP (wmhtoolgroup.com )

They cost about $200.00 and are carried by most good quality tool outlets.

[BoardSilly]

You can get low priced dust collectors from Harbor Freight Tools. Wouldn't run them in a business, but they should be fine for a home shop.

[Matthew]

This question may not be as obvious as it seems to me, but what are the guys at LHR using for cleanup? Since they're testing these machines and running projects, what do they use for cleanup and how is it hooked up?
Can any of the CarveWright staff comment?

[BobHill]

It may be different now, but at their old place, you'd be surprised at what is used (or not used)<g>. Most of the time, they didn't even vacuum out the sawdust from one run to another, but in any case there was no fancy dust collection system in place at all. Perhaps in the new area, they have more room for such things.

Bob

[Digitalwoodshop]

You have heard of the "Ugly Duck"..... Tomorrow I will post pictures of the "Ugly Duct".... My version of the upper area dust collection. It's 1.5 inches high and sit's on the tray under the door. I will need to trim part of the door, but I think it will work. Made of copper circuit board material, wood strips, foil tape and RTV. Ugly but might just work... This idea might inspire a sheet metal shop into making some... Could be a market here....

That is unless the 8 to 18 inches of snow they are calling for changes my schedule... And it was 70 yesterday.....

AL

[Gman_Ind]

after reading these great ideas I will make a down draft slot for the machine to sit on and add more air on the left side of the machine as well. We had huge dot matrix printers for mainframe printers. the guys made OSB box's lined with egg crate foam to deaden the noise from these monsters.
I was thinking a combo design combining the dust collection and sound deadening might be really good for the home shop guys. I still am in my basement until my shop is built so a cabinet like this would be great. I can also eliminate the static issue by using the properly grounded central dust collector.

[Kenm810]

I have the dust and chip problem pretty much under control for now.
I have some 4’x8’ sheets of 2” thick egg carton foam to build a sound deadening
Cover for the machine. That plus some of the ideas posted here should get me started.
For now when the machine is carving it’s set up way, way, back at the other end of the my shop.
That’s how I get my daily exercise now, you know it’s near impossible not to keep checking on it every 20 minutes.

[Digitalwoodshop]

The Ugly Duct was delayed due to wet paint, gave it an extra day to dry. Got less snow then they called for.... Only 16 inches.... Can we say Snow Blower....

AL

[Gman_Ind]

Ken it looks more like a warehouse than a shop at your place. I think the sound would be not a problem.

[Kenm810]

Gman Ind

We store a lot of the art works that we restore and repair, so I need a lot of room.
The one photo in room 3 with my youngest son pushing my CC machine has a 16' over head door, and a 10 ton crane that runs the length of the room. We can put 6 fully loaded semis with their sleeper cabs in at the same time. That way we can keep art and trucks at the same temperature, before they head out for the museums or collections.
The machine carving in the distance is like music to my ears -- Bad music but none the less -- music.

[Gman_Ind]

I thought it would be a welcomed sound!
it was a bad sound hearing mine go silent. I prefer to have it running.

[jspringertx]

This question may not be as obvious as it seems to me, but what are the guys at LHR using for cleanup? Since they're testing these machines and running projects, what do they use for cleanup and how is it hooked up?
Can any of the CarveWright staff comment?

I have been to LHR many times and their dust control consists of a small air compressor to blow off the sawdust on to the floor and the sweep it up when finished. I am certain that they will be improving their control when the big rush is over. They do an outstanding job and they really care.

Their system is very effective and they clean every machine thoroughly after testing.

[cycollins]

It's threads like this one that makes me feel unworthy to own one of these machines. See, my strong suit is in 3D rendering, image processing, etc. Workworking, shop-building, tool-maintenance...not so much. I've made some really cool projects, but the very first time I tried to carve one, I had two different failures (a stall in one axis and the infamous "please close front cover" bug). I've been making the serious mistake of thinking about this machine as a hopped-up wood-printer. In my own defence, the CW guys really reinforce this fantasy. The intro movie even likens them on to a printer and uses phrases like "nothing could be easier". More like "nothing could be further from the truth". These things are unbelievably finicky. I had 22 minutes of up-time before complete uselessness. And while the forum is a pretty responsive environment, finding answers to your specific problem accross all the threads is difficult. And while I've heard pretty good things about the CW service guys, that's not a long-term substitute for a minimal level of reliability. The dust removal systems you all have devised are excellent, but frankly I failed Air-Conditioning Maintenance 101 and if a complex dust-removal system is necessary to operate one of these babies, shouldn't CW own up to that and either incorporate one or sell one separately? Anyway, cudos to you all for your dust-removal rigs. Anyone want to throw one togethre for me?

DCC

[Kenm810]

Cycollins,
To tell the truth, an offal lot of us are no better at this stuff then you are.
We have to muddle through the learning curve like everyone else.
As for the dust collection systems, I for one just like to tinker a round and experiment.
It has nothing to do with one up man ship or anything like that,
we just like to share ideas that might help with or solve a problem here or there. That’s all.
You’re more the welcome to offer suggestions, and I’m sure a few of us crazy guys will try to build it.

[Ropdoc]

Hi All

I’ve been watching this thread about dust in the machine and what might help to get rid of some of it. The other day while standing mesmerized by the carving bit moving
Side to side up and down, side to side up and down, side to si ---- anyway why not have
A little air move up and down with it. So I tried this- No tools to install. No modification of the machine. Less then $10 bucks in parts, Hobby shop for brass tubing, Hardware store for humidifier or ice maker valve, Pet store for ¼” vinyl tubing, or auto parts store
For 1/8”rubber vacuum tubing, Plug into air line or compressor 10 to15 lbs does the trick.
Remember it should be used with a dust collection system, or down draft table.
Now just stand there and watch the dust fly as the carving bit moves Side to side up and down, side to side up and - you get the idea.

I was going to suggest this as well. Will the cool air also help keep the bit cool, just a little?

[forqnc]

See, my strong suit is in 3D rendering, image processing, etc.
DCC
And this where you could be great asset to those of us who are struggling with learning new art programs to enhance our carving. ;)
Stick with it and have patients, we are all still learning the potetial of the machine, some faster than others.

[Kenm810]

Ropdoc,

I really don’t think that the small amount of air would do much to cool the carving bit, the 5 or 10 lb. jet of air would primarily be used to lift the dust up out of the project so it can be vented away by the Vac system, and give the operator a better view of the carving process. The only way to effectively air cool a cutting bit is an air vortex powered by at least 100 lb. of pressure. It as spinning heat exchanger, about 36,000 rpm produces near 0 degrees at the bit location. Not to practical for carbide bits, it makes them even more brittle when operating. And even less practical for this machine being that its already sensitive to cold and high pressure air in side the machine.

P.S. The high pitch whine form the Vortex is nearly deafening, and is even louder than the CW machine it’s self.

[Digitalwoodshop]

This is my Ugly Duct. Made from copper circuit board material. I added some rubber seal at the underside door gap later. I also have a hole in the base of the cabinet and a 4 inch outlet for a down draft. I will use it with a bigger collector later. Used the foil hose for static control but I do have static dissipating hoses. If someone made this style in sheet metal it might work out OK. Covered the seams with foil tape and painted. Used a saber saw to cut the plastic cover. The duct is 1.5 inches high. The slant front would let the chips hit it about half way up and slide down and get sucked up. A 2 HP dust collector will work better and I will be able to hook up the back down draft outlet. In another life this cabinet held VCR recorders in a bank.

AL

[Digitalwoodshop]

Here are some more pictures.

AL

[Jeff_Birt]

But, does it suck? Chips that is...;)

[Digitalwoodshop]

It's a real "HOVER"....

AL

[MarkJamesDesign]

I am expecting my CC this coming week and was planning to use my 5hp Rigid shopvac for clean up. I have not seen any signs of static when I use this to clean my shop or other tools. I am planning to cut PVC sheet with this machine and it carrys quite a bit of static. I can usually shake the sheet enough to git rid of most of the extra electrons (or is it neutrons) but I sure don't want to kill my machine. Could a collection box made of wood be placed on the shelf and attached to my hose? I don't know much about elec. and the little I do know makes me dangerous. LOL. would appreciate some tips on how to use my current (no pun intended) vac for the cleaning. I,ve used the search and have found lots of info on how to build downdrafts with squirrels in cages (i think my modicum is showing) and other contraptions that I don't have the $$$ to construct. I would just like a safe way to use my shopvac without fear. Also, I would like to hear about other's experience with cutting PVC. Thanks in advance.

Jim

[rjp736]

Thats the magic question. I also use my shop vac to clean the machine. Don't know if it matters but I always shut my machine off before I clean it with the vac......so far so good.

[MarkJamesDesign]

Robbie,
That's what I was planning to do, but it sounds like some projects may require a vac before they are complete. Can you turn the machine off in the middle of a project and turn it back on to complete?

Jim

[rjp736]

Yes you can pause the machine and use the vac. Just keep the nozzle away from the Z truck and just use the vac on the project. Make sense?

[Gman_Ind]

I was using some shop air to dust the carving through the slot in the top and let the chips fall out the bottom slot, I don't have dust collection on this yet but it is on this weekends plans, if nothing else breaks in the shop that is. If i can work on the dust collection system as I carve with it. ;)

[BobHill]

Robbie,

When you say can you turn your machine OFF and have it return to where you left off .... NO .... You would have to start the project over as you did to start the original. It should, however, not cut any new wood until it gets to where you left off. The down side is that you can't manually jog to where you left off and have it begin, nor can you shorten the time it takes to get to that point where you left it. You can, of course left the cover which will STOP all motors, but the machine's electronics will still be active, which is what you probably are worried about.

Bob Hill
Tampa Florida

[rjp736]

Bob,

When I want to clean the area during a project I just pause the machine (stop) and continues where it left off. When I'm done with the carving I turn the machine off and remove the card for a better cleaning of the machine. Either way I stay away from the Z truck. I use air if I want to clear dust away from the Z truck.

[Gman_Ind]

I use shop air to blow out the nooks and crannies with one hand and I have the shop vac nozzle in the other hand, it takes most of the mess out of cleaning up. I will never repeat NEVER use the shop vac on the machine while it is running again. I am on #2 and suspect static killed my #1 machine.
BTW thats ow I clean out PC's except I use canned air and a small vac, it cleans better than a vac alone and is not messy like using just canned air.

[rjp736]

My question is. Do you still have to worry about static even with the machine turned off? I was just assuming it was safer.

[Kenm810]

If you’re carving machine is hooked up to a shop vac or dust collection system that is attached to other shop machines, like a table saw, planner, joiner, or other ect., and is running. Then yes even if the carver is off, even if unplugged. It may still be at risk of static electric damage if the rest of the machines and vac aren’t static protected or grounded. The static electric charge is still present and has a damaging potential until it is discharged or dissipated.

[Digitalwoodshop]

Hooked up my 2 HP dust collector and grounding wires today. Did get a small zap touching the plastic lid twice but not metal.

Was cutting PVC board and could see the difference with greater suction.

AL


And the Power Company loved it TOO..... :)

[MarkJamesDesign]

My shop vac is not connected to any equipment in "my shop" lol. It just rolls around from mess to mess and sucks. I think I'll lokk around the web on a way to ground the hose just in case.

[Kenm810]

Al
Looks sweet, nice job: and I know how the power company loves us.
At the rate we us it, wish I had thought about getting some stock in consumers power.

And MJD
By the way with bare copper wire you make you own vac hose grounding kit.

[MarkJamesDesign]

Here's a little something I found while looking for a way to ground my shop vac system. May be worth reading.

http://home.att.net/~waterfront-woods/Articles/Electricity/static.htm

[MarkJamesDesign]

This could be the greatest thing since the CW. A shop vac hose that bends and stays where you point it. I gotta get me some of this.

http://www.modularhose.com/merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=8

[Kenm810]

MJD:
Nice find, on the static.htm and the reference on incorporating PVC pipe or tubing in to your vac system is true. That’s one of the reasons I opted for the down draft cabinet using a blower rather then a vac. It’s portable and isolated from the rest of the shops dust collection grounding system. I do use 1 &#189;” PVC tubing and unglued fittings, (For flexibility) on the front of the cabinet to move and boost filtered dust free air through the machine. It dosn't not touch any part of the machine; they are anchored and supported only by the plywood front of the cabinet. The one at the back of the cabinet, vents the dust and chips from the machine through the top of the cabinet, again it is free floating and long enough to stay in the cabinet as the machine head is cranked up and down. No static problems so far, and of course – like with any other tool in the shop – I always keep a couple fingers crossed.

P.S. My machine and cabinet posted this thread 2-19-07

[Digitalwoodshop]

I am thinking a low pressure air compressor blowing the chips with a copper tube along the Z is a good addition to my system. Good Job for the guy who posted the pictures of his.

AL

[Gman_Ind]

On the bottom dust removal systems has anyone removed panels or cut holes through the bottom for the chips to flow through?

[Digitalwoodshop]

You don't need too, there is a slot in the bottom. Stuff drops through between the belts. I just put foam weather strip tape around it to seal it to the cart and 4 inch duct.

There is cooling slots on the bottom for the unit too.

AL

[Digitalwoodshop]

On my second unit I might chop a hole in the side, opposit the key pad and install a 4 inch suction plus the down draft. Then add LP air to blow to the right..... The Ugly Duct is not that effective...

AL

[HillBilly]

I first posted this picture of my portable stand last night in another thread. "Semper Fi" asked for another picture of the underside, as well a bit more info. So here goes.

The stand I`m using is a roll around tool cart from Harbor Freight. The item number is #5107-4VGA. It normally lists for $39.99. I picked up on sale for $24.99 I beleive it was. After I put the stand together. I made a top from some 3/4 plywood, routed out where the edge rails fit, cut out an area in the center to match the opening on the bottom of the CompuCarve and covered it with some trunk liner. Not only does the trunk liner look rather nice in my opinion, but it also serves as a vibration damper. I then used some 1/4 inch foam weather stripping both on the bottom of the machine and the table surface. After that I installed some small rubber washers to add not only a bit more vibration dampening, but to as well increase the "feet height" by about 5/16 of an inch. This was to allow to make sure the machine did not settle into the trunk liner and cut off any needed airflow to the underside air entry`s.

Under the top tray I cut in a four inch round hole and added an elbow sealed with foil tape on both sides and conected it to the dust collector with alum-a-vent, which by the way fits quite nicely on the bottom shelf that was placed on top of the lower tray. I`m intending to cover the lower shelf as well, just haven`t gotten around to it yet. The dust collector is also from Harbor freight item Number #311810-0VGA. It list for $119.99, I picked it up on sale for $109.99. It produces 660 CFM and has a 13 gallon bag. So far it has worked quite well, with hardly any dust remaining it the unit.

I`ve also been intrigued by the idea some of you have shown about adding a little bit of air around the chuck as it carves and the use of some lighting. I`m going to have to try to work a little something up myself along those lines. I`ve had several folks dropping by now and then to check "her" out, and I`m getting a bit tried of allways having to look for my Maglight... <grin>

[Digitalwoodshop]

Nice Job !!!!! Looks good. I agree with you, the air blowing from a tube is a good plan as the dust collecting and then sticking to the rollers could be causing some errors I read about. Rather than use my shop compressor, I am looking for a small compressor without a air tank as it will be dryer air. Shooting the chips away from the keyboard side to be sucked down and away.

Good Luck,

AL

[Kenm810]

Hi HillBilly,

I see you’ve noticed that these machines tend to attract people too. It’s kind of fun watching them bumping heads jockeying for a better view of what’s going in there, and making all that dust and noise. At first you try to figure out the strange expressions on their faces and their glazed over eyes form watching the carving bit moving back and forth, up and down. Soon you find yourself tying to field all the questions being thrown at you at the top of their lungs; I guess they think you’re probably deaf from working around the machine all the time it’s carving. Myself I like to check the machine and the flex-shaft from time to time, to make sure all is well,- and a few times found that I was at the end of the line and had to wait my turn to watch the carving bit moving back and forth, up and down.

[pkunk]

Rather than use my shop compressor, I am looking for a small compressor without a air tank as it will be dryer air.
AL
Al, what make you believe no tank makes dryer air? A cold tank will condense the water out of the air to be voided through the tank drain. Besides, I have always been under the understanding that the drier the air, the more static. Can you explain with your wisdom of this?

[Vashon]

Since your dust collector is right there permanently mounted and dedicated to the CW, why can't you draw some of that positive post-impreller air pressure from the bag mount ring? You could mount a 2.5" blastgate behind a small filter, then add a couple of reducers to get to your final bit-hose dimension. It wouldn't be a lot of pressure, but how much do you need?

[HillBilly]

Good idea Vashion. That was along the idea of what I was thinking myself. I`d just like to add a small filter as well as a regulator to it.

I would however be incline to agree with "pkunk" on his views as to the more drier the air the greater risk there is for static to develope within the removal of the dust while doing the carving. I worked for Broyhill Furniture Industries (http://www.broyhillfurniture.com) back when I lived in the western part of North Carolina had can truthfully say that a dust fire is a total nightmare to deal with. Let alone the problems that are created by an even a small discharge of an electrical current around computer components. As much as I`d like to have a small air compresser that would fit on the lower area of my stand I do beleive I`m at least going to have to go with the afore mentioned idea or use my four gallon twin tank Campbell Hausfeld for the idea of the suupply of a unit with its own sorce of portable air supply, while maintaining the the tanks with it.

Crap, I just went and measured it too, it is about 15" deep, 19" long and 17" tall. Oh well, back to the drawing board again. Dang it, ain`t that where I was just at?...<grin>

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"Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason (http://meetretailworkers.com/constitution_and_by.htm) is left free to combat it"-Thomas Jefferson

[Digitalwoodshop]

Pkunk,

Right you are..... Good Point....... Looks like Shop Air gets the job.

AL

[rjustice]

Guys, depending on how much airflow is created from the vac system, i think maybe a small air pump used in fish aquariums might work. I dont have mine on a downdraft table yet (hopefully this week i will git-er-done) but i did try an old aquarium pump during the cutting and it kept the dust from settling and i could move it around with it. I am thinking that if it is attached to the head right at the cutter, the sweeping motion would keep the board clean. I think the quality of the carvings will improve as well. I know that when dust gets between the rollers and the work piece it causes the cut level to change and leave noticable ridges on the finished part. If i keep cleaning the dust off ahead of the rollers it leaves an excellent finish.

Ron

[DocWheeler]

After seeing what others had done, I decided to upgrade my collection system from using a shop-vac to using a blower while my CC was visiting her "folks":( . Since my stand was small, I had to use a fairly small blower (about 500 cfm). I liked the idea of using a plenum and filter to avoid getting dust in the squirrel-cage.
The stand is of 1" X 1" X 1/8" square tubing and the rest is scrap plywood - I was told long ago that paint even makes your mistakes look better:) ! There are two "fixed" wheels and one caster to make moving easy (small shop).
Design changes during construction often lead to poorer results as I found out - I should have used the space on the left for the "future" drawer (as I originally intended) rather than eliminating the space on the right that I had intended for the electrical stuff (which I changed) and making that the drawer area.
Anyway, the stand is 24" X 24" X 24"; this leaves an area about 24" X 24" X 18.5" for the collector - not really enough for a full-sized blower (it would have been better if it was about 4" wider). But, as the picture shows, it does a good job of pulling dust (2 12" Last suppers). With a bigger stand I could have used a bigger filter than the 12" X 20" one.
As someone on the forum noted, a sturdy stand cuts down on the shaking. I installed two "screw-downs" on the front two corners to add rigidity.
Note: I stuck the cord into the blower outlet to move the machine and forgot to take it out for the picture.
I hope that this helps someone who is in the process of constructing their own stand.

Ken

[Kenm810]

I like the layout on your Down Draft cabinet, it looks very professionally done.
I know mine really helps shorten the clean up time when you finish a project.

[Bill]

nice idea, looks like it works well. http://www.carvewright.com/forum/images/icons/icon14.gif

[HillBilly]

Some of us around here might not be the quickest to absorb just how this equipment and its supporting software might work. But give us a little time ( and a few sips from a jug...<grin> ), and you might be a bit suprized at what some can do with them as well as providing a home for them.

I`ll third the sentiment "Doc", of a job well done. I like it. Thanks for the pics.

Buy the way, does that cabinet have a sheet metal top, or is that just the paint job ?

[DocWheeler]

Thanks for the comments - I guess that was part of my posting the pics ;)
Hillbilly - the top is of plywood, I had some very nice 3/4 oak left over from something, I hesitated using it because it was so nice.
I had several pictures that I did not include that may have helped - here are two of them. One is taken just before shipping CC back home to her parents that shows the simple dust collecter, and the second is a picture of my preparation of her "homecoming" suprise where you can see the scuffing up of the plywood top.

Ken

[rjustice]

On the bottom dust removal systems has anyone removed panels or cut holes through the bottom for the chips to flow through?


You don't need too, there is a slot in the bottom. Stuff drops through between the belts. I just put foam weather strip tape around it to seal it to the cart and 4 inch duct.

There is cooling slots on the bottom for the unit too.

AL

Finally, I got my down draft table done!!! I went with the furnace fan method that Ken went with. I used weather stripping to seal the rectangular opening on the bottom of the machine to the opening on the table. The problem I am seeing, is that the slots in the bottom of the machine are so small that they significantly reduce the CFM of the blower. I am in agreement with Gman (Mike). I would think that widening the slots in the plastic piece on the bottom would make a huge difference. I guess the biggest concern would be if I slot them out, and something happens to the machine (still have a month on the Sears warranty) will they say "sorry about your luck" since i have modified the machine.

Any thoughts on widening the slots or the warranty issues???

Ron

[Gman_Ind]

I have had decent chip removal with narrow boards, but I had a sawdust jamb up when carving a 12" piece the wood stuck and the x-axis stopped feeding so I ended up with a slot instead of a compass. I have stopped and vacuumed a bit more often now. I get a chance since the check motor error stops the machine on longer carves anyway. I an still thinking of getting more air moving through the machine somehow. I so far have only added a hole under the machine table for a large shop vac to connect to.

[Digitalwoodshop]

I bought a paper pleated filter from Penn State to sit on top of my 2 HP upper / lower cloth bag unit. Put a clear bag on the bottom and the filter on top. Wow what a difference in the Carve unit, I can see the difference in flow. Much cleaner....

AL

[rjustice]

So, Any thoughts on opening up the slots?.... or here is another idea (which i could probably answer myself if i had an assembly drawing of the machine.

Can the plastic piece be removed completely?... Does it have any purpose in life??

I see a rod running through the part. How difficult to remove it?

Ron

[Kenm810]

These are a few photos I found on the forum. One with weather strip around the center slot, one that I Modified to show the weather strip around all the slots, and one of the bottom of the machine showing all the giblets. I’m not to sure if it would a good idea to draw to much dust through all the slots and vents near the electronics under the machine. Aside from the dust bag on the back of the machine, I feel only the center slot was intended for chip and dust removal. Just my thought on your question. But always watching for new ideas.

[kyeakel]

Ken,
You'd don't have a picture of the component side of the computer do you? I've heard that the carvewright uses a 68000 cpu, but there are other more suitable mpu's out, so I'd like to verify.

Thanks,

[rjustice]

These are a few photos I found on the forum. One with weather strip around the center slot, one that I Modified to show the weather strip around all the slots, and one of the bottom of the machine showing all the giblets. I’m not to sure if it would a good idea to draw to much dust through all the slots and vents near the electronics under the machine. Aside from the dust bag on the back of the machine, I feel only the center slot was intended for chip and dust removal. Just my thought on your question. But always watching for new ideas.

Ken,

Thank you for the views of the bottom side of the machine without the cover in place... It definately looks like the center plastic part is part of the whole bottom housing, so it cant simply be removed. I also see why it wouldnt be a very good idea to pull vaccume through the cooling louvers are in the sheet metal cover. It appears that it would contaminate the electronics with dust. So, I guess there are a few things that would improve the situation. One would be to widen the slots in the plastic allowing more volume of air to flow through. The next would be to add a little air to move the dust right at the point of the cut. And i think lastly, would be to add the port oppisite the key pad like Pkunk did. I carved a 14 1/2 inch wide part last night and the vacume didnt do very much with MDF. I think the port would allow for those instances where you block off the bottom with full width parts.

Thanks Ken, and everyone else, for your input...


Ron

[Kenm810]

Sorry Kipp, I haven’t a picture of component side of the computer myself, but I do seem to recall a photo someone posted of it a month or so ago, (more searching I guess.)

Ron, When I use a sled or project board for a carving over 8”, I use some of the filtered air to wash back through the machine to force some of the dust and chips along side of the project away from the rollers and out the back. My down draft cabinet's top is tapered to center under the machine and is covered with 1/4” Peg Board, by covering different areas of the top as needed, the blower can catch the dust and chips were ever they exiting the machine. When I get back to the shop tomorrow I’ll post some photos so you can see what I’m babbling about. I’m sure as long as I have this machine I’ll never be satisfied, I guess it’s just in my nature to keep experimenting.

[Digitalwoodshop]

The bottom slot is somewhat sealed from the computer side of the bottom. A set of vent slots are in the bottom but if you use the weather seal you prevent from drawing a suction on the computer box part.

Here are some pictures.

AL

[Digitalwoodshop]

It wouldn't let me edit the last entry but I had another thought to pass on. The flaw in my opinion with the Play Station 2's that I fixed for about 2 years was the cooling fan pulling smoke through the DVD Tray slot and past the optic. This deposited tar on the optic and when someone used a eye lash type DVD slot cleaner it smeared and wouldn't play. No one ever smokes using a PS2..... Right.....

With that thought in mind, if you use a full down draft table and drew a suction on the 2 vent slots to the computer area you could collect dust inside the computer area from joints and where the cables go up and inside the top area. This dust over time could catch fire if the power supply got too hot or the sand paper drive circuit got too hot.

I wonder if that circle area on the underside was a cooling fan or dust extraction? Any thoughts?

AL

[Digitalwoodshop]

So, Any thoughts on opening up the slots?.... or here is another idea (which i could probably answer myself if i had an assembly drawing of the machine.

Can the plastic piece be removed completely?... Does it have any purpose in life??

I see a rod running through the part. How difficult to remove it?

Ron

The rod is the cross connect to raise and lower the unit with one hand crank.

See all the areas where dust could collect if you draw a suction on the vents.

AL

I jumped in at the last page and didn't see some of my pictures already posted so I repeated some.... Sorry....

Since I am "Gloating" .... I added the last picture. A mini Carvewright.... Sort of.... a Xenetech 912.... Rotary Engraver. I can now do fine fonts. 2 lasers, 1 Rotary, 2 CarveWrights, Sublimation, Band Saw Mill.... "He who dies with the most toys (Tools) wins"

[DocWheeler]

Ken,

In the back of one of the pictures there seems to be some sound deadening material. Could it be that you have started yet another project?

Ken

[castingman]

Hi, my first post, i made a down draft table for mine but i havent used it yet. waiting for a z truck

[Kenm810]

castingman,
Welcome to the wood chippers -- fun and mayhem


DocWheeler,
Ya caught me, just playing around in my mind with some ideas for now; I have only a couple pieces right now with more coming, I hope. Some of our suppliers use it as packing material when we order parts. Isn’t that nice of them. I guess I have enough to make some kind of a hush pile cap, could you picture that? Another hat for folks to pick on.