Conforming vectors are too deep message

[Dale]

I recently made a house number sign using raster numbers and it came out fine. Today I decided to experiment using the same design only using conforming vectors for the numbers. In designer it looked fine but when I went to upload it to the card I get the message "The following conforming vectors are too deep, or exceed the capability of the bit." My numbers were 4.637 " tall. Other than trial and error is there a way of knowing that the numbers are too big? Seems kind of late to get the message when everything is complete and you are uploading it to the card.
Thanks
Dale

[fwharris]

I believe it is telling you the depth of cut for your font type and with the bit selection in carving lower than what the bit can reach. I am seeing the total depth for the font being around .800. I do not have my card with me so experiment with a different font or bit and see if the message goes away.

[myshop1044]

Dale I played around with your mpc.
First you'r using a 1/2 dp region and I found 90d bits don't work well
in deep region. The bit has to travel a .5 deep then try to carve the letters,
the 90d bit is not as long as the 60d bit and it can not travel as deep.
to get around your problem, I started reducing the height of the text by .1
and tried loading it to the card, when I reached 4.167,a 1/2" in. difference,
the load worked. You have no control over the depth using CL. The only control
you have is the size of the text. 1/2" did not make a difference in appearnce to me.
Try playing withit that way, maybe it will help.

Perry B.

[bergerud]

I switched the 90 degree bit with the 1/2 classical and he error went away. If the 90 degree bit can make it to the to the bottom of the numbers before the truck bottoms out, I do not see the message making sense. I would (not saying you should) choose the 1/2 classical but use the 90 degree and see what happens.

[Dale]

I agree with you, but is there a way of knowing this before actually uploading it to the card? I resized the numbers to 2" and uploaded it to the card and it took, then tried 3", 4", 4.5" and finally at 4.6" I get the warning message. It just seems strange that you having to wait until you upload the design to the card to find that you have a problem.

[bergerud]

It would be nice to get earlier warnings. I suppose many problems can only be found while "compiling" to machine carve instructions. In your case, for example, the numbers are in a carve region and the interaction between the two is probably only noticed when compiling.

[Dale]

Thanks for all of the replies. I will experiment with using different bits and see which one I like the best.

Dale

[AskBud]

It would be nice to get earlier warnings. I suppose many problems can only be found while "compiling" to machine carve instructions. In your case, for example, the numbers are in a carve region and the interaction between the two is probably only noticed when compiling.When Conforming Vectors is applied, the software is taking into consideration the vector(s) involved and the bit diameter as well as the depth and side wall of the raster carve region where the bit and chuck will travel. Its goal is to protect the unit from damage due to any moving part striking the higher non-carved surface.
In your case carve region along with the size of your text poses depth and side clearance problems with the 90 degree bit and/or the chuck. Changing to the 60 degree v-bit will help, but the other parameters will also need to change as well.
Since you carved this successfully as a Raster text, you may be just as well off to stick to that plan, as you may not like the smaller size text on this sign.

If you "Hide" your carve region, you will see that the Centerline text will carve well on the top surface, which points to the clearance conflicts with the Conforming Vectors application on this design.
AskBud

[bergerud]

In this case, I do not think it is a clearance problem since the error message goes away when a bigger bit is selected. My guess is that the message has simply to do with the depth. The software may be programed to avoid the z stall which could occur if the truck bottoms out.

[cestout]

For the 5/4 top insert on my Treasure Chest project say to use a second spacer on the V bit because you get a Z error - the truck hits the stop pin -if you try to reach that far with the normal setup. It was frustrating to get to the last part of a 2+ hr 2 sided carve to be stopped by that.
Clint

[AskBud]

OK,
I had some spart time to prove my premise of CV conflict(s).
I took the original MPC, edited the number to 294, and sized that text to 4.6" high. It passed muster! I then went back and uses the original number, but re-sized the height to 4" and made sure the the text was equally spaced from any higher edge. This also passed muster with no error. I made no other change to the original MPC!

This proves the software was, indeed, concerned with the mechanics of the moving parts striking a higher surface and causing an abort.
AskBud
54007

[bergerud]

Well I cannot understand that Bud. I moved the surroundings away from the numbers and still got the error. Another programming mystery to me!

[fwharris]

To me it looked like "conforming vectors are too deep, or exceed the capability of the bit." is telling us that the depth exceeds the limits of the bit.

[AskBud]

Well I cannot understand that Bud. I moved the surroundings away from the numbers and still got the error. Another programming mystery to me!I anticipated that response, and Floyd is also correct (to a degree).
My testing of the original MPC began with hiding the carve region which showed the centerline text would carve correctly outside a carve region. I then moved to my premise of re-sizing the text (which will change the overall depth as you re-size).

As I type this reply, I'm uploading a new lesson. It appears this upload will last about an hour at my ISP speed(s), so I'll do another post as soon as the upload is complete.

Trust me, It works!
AskBud

[AskBud]

I'll begin by stating that Centerline text is dependant upon the font selected for its original carve depth. Increasing or decreasing the text size also changes that original depth, as will applying the BOLD setting.
When applying Conforming Vectors to this text, so that it will carve in a carve region or on a pattern you will find other little road-blocks. You could get an error message because the combined depth is too deep, or the moving parts may strike a higher surface. Each bit has an assigned limit that the software is programmed to consider. Sometimes a few of us assign a different bit to avoid the error, and then substitute the bit we desire (this is done at our personal risk, until LHR adds bits to the selection or modifies the bit standard maximum depth of carve).
This 266 MB lesson is developed to explain one way to resolve an error when using Conforming Vectors on the given text on a specific design.
AskBud
http://www2.wcoil.com/~nharbison/CW-Conforming%20Vector%20Error.zip

[bergerud]

After some experimenting of my own, I know what the problem is. It is not that the 90 degree bit is not long enough or that it might interfere with carving edges. It is a bug!! The 90 degree bit is not allowed to cut deeper than 3/8" below the surface (the depth of the slanted cutting edges). Ok, that is fine. When using the bit with conforming vectors, however, the bit should be able to cut 3/8" deeper than the carved surface. Herein lies the bug: the program measures the 3/8" from the board surface instead of the carved surface. This is a bug with conforming vectors which seems only to apply to the 90 degree bit. (I have not tried them all.)

The problem with the center line text was that parts of the numbers were below the 3/8" from the board surface.

To try it: draw a line segment and assign the V90. At a depth of 3/8" it will be ok. (At 0.38 it will error.) Now at 3/8" , place a rectangle carved to 0.1 under it and conform - error.

[RMarkey]

Try adjusting the size of the font a bit smaller, it should get you past a "sticking point" (i.e. math error), and allow you to conform to the full depth.