Machine not holding straight line while carving

[Denise]

I am new to Carve Wright. This system is less than 60 days old and causing issues.

I was Carving onto Corian and the image border line as well as the image, shifted during operation. Not sure how to word it exactly, but I have attached an image to better show what happened.

This is not the first time this has happened to me. This is the 3rd carving in a row (all were different images) and each of them all shifted somewhere between 50 - 70 % completion. Any help in correcting this issue is greatly appreciated.

System is a new machine (Version C) and currently has 7 hours and 3 minutes. It is well maintained and vacuumed / cleaned after each use.

I can't find any of the answers on the forums. Any help is greatly appreciated.

[Denise]

Here is a better image to show the issue...and yes there is a crack through the center as I broke it before I decided to write and ask for help.

thanks again52254

[fwharris]

Looks like a classic case of Corian dust/chips in the Y and Z drive belts. Had the very same (well a lot worse actually) thing happen to my first litho carve.

Inspection of the machine found packed chips in the pulley gears and belts. This caused them to jump/skip and shift the carving start points. This was even with stopping every 5 minutes to vacuum the machine out.

The Corian dust/chips do not compress like wood dust and seem to build up a lot faster.

A good dust collection system is your best choice if you plan on doing a lot of Corian or acrylic carvings. Depending on the CFM rating of the dust collector I would also recommend pausing the machine during the carve to inspect and clean the Y and Z gears and belts.

[LittleRedWoodshop]

I think Floyd nailed it.

[Digitalwoodshop]

It could also be a case of the 7 inch rule of wood.... The board coming out from under the rollers.... I am also thinking dull bit....

2nd post....

Did you get a chance to read the Tips and Tricks and use a sled or Carrier Board?

What setting are you using for carving? Normal, Best or Optimized?

Could be your biting too deep in the Corian... Corian is Harder than Wood and the machine is really setup with a feed rate for PINE.... The Bit may be pushed TOO FAST and the cutter just cannot keep up with the Feed Rate and there is back pressure on the bit....

IS the board Slipping on the Sand Paper Belts because of Side Pressure and a Fast Feed Rate?

Did you use Masking Tape to prevent the Brass Roller from slipping on the Corian? Or do you have a wood sled?

ARE you keeping at least 4 inches of Waste Wood under the rollers or are you letting the board come out from under a roller and tipping UP ad loosing contact with the Brass Roller..?

And YES... YOU need a Ringneck OR Clear Dust Collector for Corian.... It makes a MESS and sticks to Moving Surfaces..

Let us know,

AL

[Denise]

FWHarris,

Thanks for the reply. I cleaned out the tracks with an air hose. There was alot of corian still in there that the shop vac did not pull out. I have not tried it yet to see if it has corrected. Will keep everyone posted.

As for the dust collection, we had purchased a used carvewright in January (version A) that had modifications for dust collections. We enjoyed it enough that we bought this C version machine as well. Going forward, from everyone's comments, we decided to use the older machine for corian carving and the new machine for wood.

[lynnfrwd]

Looks like it will be an awesome litho design, too!

[Denise]

Al,

Thanks for the response. Let me see if I can answer your questions.


It could also be a case of the 7 inch rule of wood.... The board coming out from under the rollers.... I am also thinking dull bit....

It could be dull. But this is a new bit. Only 7 hours on the machine total.


Did you get a chance to read the Tips and Tricks and use a sled or Carrier Board?

I did get the chance to read Tips and Tricks. I use a sled for most everything I have carved to date. Only exception to that is a large piece of wood.


What setting are you using for carving? Normal, Best or Optimized?

This particular carving was set for Normal


Could be your biting too deep in the Corian... Corian is Harder than Wood and the machine is really setup with a feed rate for PINE.... The Bit may be pushed TOO FAST and the cutter just cannot keep up with the Feed Rate and there is back pressure on the bit....

I guess it is possible. I have the depth set for .185. I am not sure what depth is a proper one. Does this look like a good one, or would you recommend 2 passes?


IS the board Slipping on the Sand Paper Belts because of Side Pressure and a Fast Feed Rate?

Not sure it makes a difference, but we opted for the upgraded track belt. I have not seen it slipping, but will watch closer to be sure during next carve.


Did you use Masking Tape to prevent the Brass Roller from slipping on the Corian? Or do you have a wood sled?

Most of my carvings have been with a sled. In this case, the Corian is 8" x 6" x .250" thick. The Sled is 15.5" x 8" x .750". The sled has worked well with previous carvings.


ARE you keeping at least 4 inches of Waste Wood under the rollers or are you letting the board come out from under a roller and tipping UP ad loosing contact with the Brass Roller..?

Just shy of 4" of waste under the rollers. I do watch for the board tipping up and losing contact. I don't think this is the issue in this case.


And YES... YOU need a Ringneck OR Clear Dust Collector for Corian.... It makes a MESS and sticks to Moving Surfaces..

As I mentioned to FWHarris above, we have purchased an older version A machine, that was already modified with a dust collector attached in January (our first taste of Carvewright). We have decided to use the older machine for Corian only since it causes more issues than wood chips.

Would you recommend the same dust collector for the new machine for wood products?

Thank you all for taking the time to help us in correcting these issues. You are greatly appreciated

[Denise]

Thanks....I like it too....Eagle with American flag on one wing and POW/MIA flag on other.

[fwharris]

As I mentioned to FWHarris above, we have purchased an older version A machine, that was already modified with a dust collector attached in January (our first taste of Carvewright). We have decided to use the older machine for Corian only since it causes more issues than wood chips.

Would you recommend the same dust collector for the new machine for wood products?

Silly question for me ;)! I recommend dust collection for all of the machines!

If I may ask what type/version of dust collection do you have on the A machine?

[Denise]

As a way of saying thank you to everyone who helps me correct my issues, I have uploaded my image. Hope you like it / enjoy it as much as I do52296

[Denise]

Central Machinery
12 Gallon, Single Phase, 35 Micron Filter, 914 CFM max

Machine is modified to remove cover. Attached to a home made box (which is directly in front of the carving bit) and reduced opening to suck up most of shavings as it carves. It does not get all of them, but does get most.

[dcalvin4]

Central Machinery
12 Gallon, Single Phase, 35 Micron Filter, 914 CFM max

Machine is modified to remove cover. Attached to a home made box (which is directly in front of the carving bit) and reduced opening to suck up most of shavings as it carves. It does not get all of them, but does get most.

do not use a vacuum to clean machine durnig or after a carve un less properly grounded , static can zap your on board puter ,
nice pattern of miapow eagle
denny

[Digitalwoodshop]

Good Job in all the correct things you are doing...

I would take a close look at using Normal, Best, and Optimal... I usually use Best..... One time I used Normal I saw the Y moving SO fast, I didn't like the Quality of the cut.... That is a really nice design.... I would cut it on Best or Optimal to slow down the head... And Optimize the Pattern Carving too... A few years ago I got a email with a similar Eagle and made a Dozen Mouse Pads with the Image for the local VA Clinic I use for my Health Care for Xmas. I still see them in use.... Cool Design....

AL

[Denise]

It has extra grounding strap...thanks

[Denise]

Thanks for the info AL...I will keep it in mind.

Glad you like the image also :D

[Denise]

Floyd,

This seems to be getting worse with this machine, especially on larger jobs, which is frustrating. I have cleaned it and blown it out with an air hose etc... It still seems to be skipping / sliding out of line. Where did the build up you are referring to from the corian carves accumulate? I don't see that in our case. (Doesn't mean I am not overlooking it). What is the best way to clean these areas...maybe we are doing that incorrectly. We changed our dust collection to a shop fox dust collector. Has a strong suction and seems to pull most of the chips when carving, so I am not sure what is happening. I read somewhere that the belts may be needing tightened. Does that sound logical to you? (This is Rich, Denise and I are both frustrated with this)

Rich

[fwharris]

Floyd,

This seems to be getting worse with this machine, especially on larger jobs, which is frustrating. I have cleaned it and blown it out with an air hose etc... It still seems to be skipping / sliding out of line. Where did the build up you are referring to from the corian carves accumulate? I don't see that in our case. (Doesn't mean I am not overlooking it). What is the best way to clean these areas...maybe we are doing that incorrectly. We changed our dust collection to a shop fox dust collector. Has a strong suction and seems to pull most of the chips when carving, so I am not sure what is happening. I read somewhere that the belts may be needing tightened. Does that sound logical to you? (This is Rich, Denise and I are both frustrated with this)

Rich

Rich,

I just did a very quick look back on your problem with the carving jumping while carving lihtos. I saw a few comments on the settings used and would like to make sure what you are using.

Bit optimization?
Depth and Height of pattern settings?
Carve quality setting when you up loaded the project to the card?
These setting do impact how hard the machine works to do the carving.

I am most certain you have done a good job on cleaning. The main areas to look at at the Z and Y belts, gears, roller bearings and rails.

Machine areas to look at would the the Y gear and bearings. Loosen the Y belt tension and see if there is any play in the main Y gear and shaft.

[badbert]

I would suggest that you take the y motor apart and check for movement on the gear or broken teeth as well.

[liquidguitars]

what chuck are you using?

[LittleRedWoodshop]

encoder? ....

[unitedcases]

Jason hit it, I second that the encoder is packed with dust.

[Denise]

Bit optimization?
I did not set a bit optimization


Depth and Height of pattern settings?
Height = 100
Depth = .225


Carve quality setting when you up loaded the project to the card?
Set for best

This instance was not carving corian....I was carving into red cedar. 12"x24". Never had this issue before for wood

[Denise]

I would suggest that you take the y motor apart and check for movement on the gear or broken teeth as well.

If all else fails I will do that. this machine is not that old..I bought it in March or April...and haven't put alot of hours on it. Trying to spend more time with the family too...this is supposed to be my relaxation time...lol....oh well...

[Denise]

what chuck are you using?

The machine is only a few months old (version C). It is not the quick disconnect...I assume that is what you are asking about

[badbert]

We just saw a y drive bearing failure on a newer machine. His machine changed directions as well.

[fwharris]

Things I would try/do:

Reformat the card and re load the project.

Check the encoder in the back of the Z and Y motors. Remove the black cover and check for any dust/dirt build up. Blow it out with LOW volume air. Check the thin disc for any nicks and looseness. Be very careful in handling/working around the disc.

[Digitalwoodshop]

If I understand you are cutting Corian... IF SO.... The Density of Corian and the Slickness could cause the bit to dull quickly and it is just riding up over the Corian not cutting it..... And too, the Y Gearbox can wear quickly cutting Corian. The machine is designed with a feed rate for WOOD.... I would only cut Corian in Optimal Mode to slow down the cutting process slightly. Doing a Draft Cut would make the cutter FLY over the Corian. I would also look for a frozen Y Rail Bearing too... And like others have said to look into the Encoder...

IF you are seeing a REVERSAL of the Y during a cut OR see it jerk then 75% of the time it is the 2 bearings inside the Y Gearbox.


To test the machine I would make a Circle and assign the 1/8 inch cutting bit and a depth of say .1


Put the project in the machine and after the bit checks REMOVE THE BIT.... What this can check is cutting a circle WITHOUT the BIT so you are seeing the motion of the Gearbox under NO LOAD.... IF it jerks then the Bearings or Encoder are bad.


AL

[Denise]

Things I would try/do:

Reformat the card and re load the project.

Check the encoder in the back of the Z and Y motors. Remove the black cover and check for any dust/dirt build up. Blow it out with LOW volume air. Check the thin disc for any nicks and looseness. Be very careful in handling/working around the disc.

Will check these areas out

[Denise]

If I understand you are cutting Corian... IF SO.... The Density of Corian and the Slickness could cause the bit to dull quickly and it is just riding up over the Corian not cutting it..... And too, the Y Gearbox can wear quickly cutting Corian. The machine is designed with a feed rate for WOOD.... I would only cut Corian in Optimal Mode to slow down the cutting process slightly. Doing a Draft Cut would make the cutter FLY over the Corian. I would also look for a frozen Y Rail Bearing too... And like others have said to look into the Encoder...

I do cut corian sometimes...but getting away from it and concentrating more on wood. Good tips..thanks


IF you are seeing a REVERSAL of the Y during a cut OR see it jerk then 75% of the time it is the 2 bearings inside the Y Gearbox.


To test the machine I would make a Circle and assign the 1/8 inch cutting bit and a depth of say .1


Put the project in the machine and after the bit checks REMOVE THE BIT.... What this can check is cutting a circle WITHOUT the BIT so you are seeing the motion of the Gearbox under NO LOAD.... IF it jerks then the Bearings or Encoder are bad.


AL

Will check this later. Thanks...sounds like a good test

[LittleRedWoodshop]

Have you checked the encoders?

I had the exact same issue (my machine was cutting toy soldiers with curved bodies), I pulled the cover off of the motor and adjusted the encoder and I was back on track. I have noticed that on the new machines they are clear.