Cut motor not working.

[jeff412]

I've got 78 cut hours on my machine. The cut motor has stopped working. It was working then I changed the belts and vacuumed it. There was some static from the vacuuming. When I put it all back together the cut motor wasn't working. When I close the cover while in a job the motor will spin for a split second.(It has always done this) I've searched here and done the following.

1. tested cover switches. They passed continuity test
1a. Did trust test so I bypassed cover switch. (Still nothing)
2. Removed cut motor control board and tested capacitor and triac. (both passed)
3. Checked all connections and everything is tight.

Question:
1. How do I test the motor sensor?
2. Any ideas what else I should check?

Jeff

[jeff412]

I am running version 1.179 of the software. I reloaded it just to be sure there wasn't a glitch and still nothing. I retested the cap at c1 and it tests as 101 nF, which is .1 uF.

1. What sends the control to the motor control board?
2. Are there schematics anywhere?

Jeff

[Digitalwoodshop]

This is a classic C1 is snapped off but you did test it....

I would say to check the cut motor brushes as one could be hanging up.... Could be a loose wire inside the cut motor.... A chip of sawdust under a brush...

There are other components on the X Termination Board too that can go bad....

Also try pushing on the clear plastic cover to see if the screw holes holding the switch in position have been cracked and loose. This will cause the switch to not be close enough for the closed cover to activate it. Pushing on the plastic cover toward the switch could find this.

The broken holes are caused by removing the top cover and not supporting the clear plastic cover and letting it rest on the 2 switches pushing them to the point of breaking.

AL

[jeff412]

Al,

Yes, C1 is solidly attached and I tested the cap from traces on the board and not from the legs of the cap. I actually bypassed the switch to eliminate the switch problem, but to no avail. I haven't researched the 4 pin and 6 pin chips on the cut motor control board, so I haven't tested those yet. I was hoping to get some schematics to trace the control path.

Jeff

[Digitalwoodshop]

The Chips might me Photo Coupler with a LED inside and a Triac or SCR output to feed the trigger on the Q1.

AL

OK... Looked them up...

U1 http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/M/O/C/3/MOC3011-M.shtml Triac

U2 http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/D/F/0/4/DF04.shtml Rectifier

U3 http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/4/N/3/3/4N33.shtml Opto coupler

[jeff412]

Tested Q1 and it tested good. I called tech support today and they couldn't help. They seem to think it may be a problem on the primary controller board. I am going to test for voltage on the motor control board. Does anyone know where I should see 120V on that board when the motor's not running?

Jeff

[jeff412]

I've got 120V on the motor control board from the power supply and up to the cover switch. I guess that's why the motor spins sometimes when you close the cover. Did a few tests tonight on that and it doesn't have to be in a job to make the motor spin. It's really looking like the main controller may be my problem.

Jeff

[Digitalwoodshop]

I don't know if you did this yet... I read so many posts.... Since the operating system for the machine is on the card, a reformat and reload the latest designer could help..... Worth a try before a $300.00 controller...

You didn't put your location on the top right of your posts... Anyone near you that can swap parts...?

And just for $hitts and Giggles... Do a Sensor Check to be sure you get normal stuff... I had a shorted Board Sensor Cable, pinched wire, that did strange stuff.... Even the Close cover was acting up.... No Z Data...

Also re seat all your computer cables and the one going to your 14 pin FFC Cable....

AL

[jeff412]

1. Thanks for the heads up on the location. Didn't realize I never entered that. Sure thought I had. I don't know if there is anyone near me with one or not. There used to be a map somewhere, but I don't know where that is anymore.
2. Yes I did reformat and re-install the software. It had no effect.
3. I'll check the sensors this morning. Is there a sensor check for the motor somewhere? I couldn't find it.
4. What is the 14 pin FFC Cable?




Jeff

[Dan-Woodman]

Jeff
You can find others near you at www.cncartguild.com (http://www.cncartguild.com) under membership list.
later Daniel

[gregsolano]

1. Thanks for the heads up on the location. Didn't realize I never entered that. Sure thought I had. I don't know if there is anyone near me with one or not. There used to be a map somewhere, but I don't know where that is anymore.
2. Yes I did reformat and re-install the software. It had no effect.
3. I'll check the sensors this morning. Is there a sensor check for the motor somewhere? I couldn't find it.
4. What is the 14 pin FFC Cable?

Jeff

Photo courtesy of Al. of FFC Cable

45157

[jeff412]

Called tech support again today. I spoke to someone and explained the problem. I told him that it seemed like it was the main controller to me. He told me that he'd have to escalate it to engineering, but that it would cost me $25.00. I paid. He put me on hold for about 5 minutes, while he talked to the engineer. When he came back on the phone he said it was probably the controller. I thought I was paying to talk to someone else. I guess I just paid to get the answer that I had already given him. Anyway, ordered a new controller, HD belts, Carvetight truck, and Carvetight bits. I already had a rock chuck, but it was the 1/4" one, so I couldn't use 1/2" bits. Figured I might as well upgrade it while I could combine the shipping.

Jeff

[jeff412]

Turns out it was the controller. Evidently the "thorough" vacuuming I gave the machine caused enough static to damage the controller. At least it's back up and running again. Thanks for all the help guys!


jEFF

[unitedcases]

Definitely time to "ground" your machine. I blew two controllers before I learned my lesson. That hurt my wallet.

[jeff412]

I guess I'm off to do some research on grounding then.

Jeff

[jeff412]

Can't really find anything. Any recommendations on what to ground?

Jeff

[jeff412]

I went out to cut a project and the motor seems to run wide open. Maybe I didn't plug the motor speed sensor back in. I don't know. I'm frustrated with it right now because it broke a brand new carvetight bit before the bit even hit the board. UGGHHHH!

Jeff

[unitedcases]

When I grounded mine, as directed by Al: Looking at the keypad side, the bottom sandpaper roller to your right. Now look at the 2 screws securing that down on the Non-keypad side. I used the forward allen screw. I just backed it up a bit and wrapped normal "3rd black wire" out of a scrap piece of 14 guage conduit I had and connected it directly to the middle screw on the nearest Plug outlet. Have had no static problems since.

[jeff412]

Could you take a picture of where you grounded it?

Jeff

[jeff412]

Ended up sending it in, just to get it completely refurbed, recalibrated and upgraded. I got it back today and put the first board in and as soon as it rolled out from under the roller while measuring, I got "Check tracking roller". I didn't have masking tape on this board, so I took it out and put a strip on each side, stuck it back in and same thing. Did they not even test this thing? Man I'm frustrated. I've spent over $1000.00 in the past two weeks and it still doesn't work.

Jeff

[jeff412]

Found a thread about the compression rollers causing this. I checked my roller switches and the back one seemed to be sticking. I blew it out with compressed air as suggested in the maintenance pdf. That seemed to clear up the roller switch sticking. I put another board in and got the same error. I then tried adding a little pressure to the head as I cranked it down. That made it work. It must be a combination of the sticking switch and head pressure. Frustrating, because it just came back from them and head pressure was one of the things I wanted checked. At least it's cutting right now. I hope this is the last of my woes with this machine for a while.

Jeff

[unitedcases]

Man, sorry to hear of all your issues. Sounds like my first machine. Luckily, (or maybe not lucky), after I spent a wad of cash as well, Fedex ruined the machine more when they returned and I got a brand new one, courtesy of Carvewright. Version B. Version A definitely took some money from me. I would have thought blowing out the compression rollers would have done the trick. What color wood are you using? I.E. red oak, walnut, pine, etc.

[b.sumner47]

Jeff,Take a look at the tracking roller and see if the "O"ring is on the brass . If yes,then try and see if you can push it up and down. Capt Barry

[fwharris]

Jeff,

Some times in shipping the machine will get bounced around. You might want to re check your head pressure and head alignment.

[jeff412]

Man, sorry to hear of all your issues. Sounds like my first machine. Luckily, (or maybe not lucky), after I spent a wad of cash as well, Fedex ruined the machine more when they returned and I got a brand new one, courtesy of Carvewright. Version B. Version A definitely took some money from me. I would have thought blowing out the compression rollers would have done the trick. What color wood are you using? I.E. red oak, walnut, pine, etc.

Not real sure what it is. It's 5/8" plywood. Looks like birch. It's very light wood though.

[jeff412]

Jeff,Take a look at the tracking roller and see if the "O"ring is on the brass . If yes,then try and see if you can push it up and down. Capt Barry

Yes the o-ring is there. That was the first thing I checked. Not sure what you mean by "push it up and down". Can you elaborate?

Jeff

[jeff412]

Jeff,

Some times in shipping the machine will get bounced around. You might want to re check your head pressure.

I will. I was just frustrated and had to vent a little.


and head alignment.


How do you check head alignment?


Jeff

[AskBud]

Review this link on ways to check your Head Level.
AskBud
http://forum.carvewright.com/showthread.php?15961-Left-belt-moving-to-back-of-machine&p=135758#post135758

[unitedcases]

Sometimes dust can get under your brass tracking roller and not let it work quite correctly. Check to make sure that you can physically "flex" the brass roller up and down. Not too hard though cause you can snap it.

[jeff412]

Sometimes dust can get under your brass tracking roller and not let it work quite correctly. Check to make sure that you can physically "flex" the brass roller up and down. Not too hard though cause you can snap it.

Ok. I'll give that a shot. It looks like the brass roller is the same height as the new HD belts.

Jeff

[b.sumner47]

Jeff , Take your finger and push the roller up and down, see that it moves without to much resistance. The tracking roller has to move up & down to compensate for faults in the wood. Capt Barry

[cnsranch]

Isn't the o ring larger in diameter when you're using the new belts?

Could be using an original o ring? If so, it will not track, I'm sure.

[jeff412]

Isn't the o ring larger in diameter when you're using the new belts?

Could be using an original o ring? If so, it will not track, I'm sure.


That would explain the issue. But then you would think that new o-rings would come with the belts. I had LHR change the belts for me. I would think they would make the change if it needed it.

Jeff

[chebytrk]

The new "O" ring does come with the new rubber belts in the rubber belts package. I changed my "O" ring to the new one that came with my belts. My problem was that a couple of weeks later I noticed that I had lost my "O" ring from the brass roller and didn't know it. I was actually still carving projects with no problem and with no "O" ring. I ordered a new one, but as Michael T. pointed out, we were actually told during the conference that the "O" ring isn't really necessary. I was able to prove that because even while waiting for my new "O" ring, I kept on carving projects with no problems.

[jeff412]

I know I have an O-ring. I don't know if it is the original or not. I have no way to know if it was changed. Sounds like I don't need it anyway. I'll check for the movement in the brass roller when I get home.

Jeff

[jeff412]

Tried moving the brass roller. If it moves, it's not much. Tried starting another project and no problems. It's carving right now. Hopefully it's fixed.

Jeff

[bogwojny]

Was doing a carve and at about 33% it was working then it would slow down slightly and cpl times then it just stopped working. When I press to continue the motor doesnt work but the bit does it up and down and side to side deal......could the motor be out??

[bogwojny]

Found the right thread about it....