horrible accuracy issues + bit question

[jerryherb]

Hello,
I bought a used, upgraded machine from some guy who claimed to be an LHR tech, it came with rubber belts, carvetight chuch, probe, most recent software/firmware and even LHR invoice. within 2 hours i started getting RPM sensor errors and had that replaced as the guy would not answer any emails regarding support he supposedly offered. regardless. Now that i got a little more experience with the machine i noticed a horrible, yet almost deliberate precision issue. it seems most noticeable on the inside square/rectangle cuts/routs. as soon as the cutter head changes direction from x to y axis (both away and towards the panel) it seems at about 3/8 of an inch to move in slightly (x-axis move) towards the inside of the figure being cut and its being consistent. for example: if i had four of the same mirrored figures the same "error" would occur in all of them, however its consistency would not be mirrored. please see attached pictures for better explanation. Also, all the interior corners would not be of the same radius either (not mirrored as well but identical along specific turns in each figure). it almost seems as if depending on which turn it took (x to y and y to x) they were they were out of sync while turning, but repeat exactly the same in each figure cut. has anyone experienced anything like this before? i spent a few hours scouring the forum, but had not found anything similar.

On the topic of bits. i just broke my 1/16 cutter and noticed that carvewright does not offer the 1/16 cutter bit for sale anymore. i was going to purchase one of Ron's adapters (1/2 to 1/8), but need a source for bits. does anyone know of alternative sources?

All your help is greatly appreciated, thanks!

Greg


44021

44022

44023

[Digitalwoodshop]

Greg,

Looks like I am your answer to your Midnight East coast posting...

Sorry about your RPM Error but if you get a Check Cut Motor 30 seconds into a project first bit.... well WE all get it.... OR most of us do from time to time.... Press enter and off it goes... I have my Theories as to why.... But nothing solid... WE live with it....

I am betting the issues you see are part equipment and part Pilot Error.... The Equipment Side could be the Y Bearings in the Gear Box are going bad.... How many Cut Motor Hours? That will tell the story.. About 450 then replace the bearings... Lots of posts on the size... Use the "Y Bearings" with the " " on each side to let Search Work.

Next is the 7 inch rule of Wood.... Reading all the Tips and Tricks and knowing or thinking like a machine when the board is NOT under 2 rollers it can pop UP snapping your bit.... Like riding a bike with 1 hand.... Works Great until..... Next is Using Masking Tape on the bottom of the board at the brass roller to let a Rack and Pinion be formed in the soft tape. The Brass Roller loosing contact with the bottom of the board is also where your broken bits come from... The board drives until the Brass Roller numbers are correct and if the board has lost contact with the brass roller will keep moving the X snapping the bit with the same gear train that has the power to move a 12 foot board.... We call this problem "Pilot Error".

The next is trying to HOG out too much with the bit..... Be Conservative... Use Depth of Cut..... The harder the Wood the harder it is to cut by the bit.... The machine has a feed RATE that is setup for Pine.... That looks like HARDWOOD.... You need to be more Conservative with Oak... Use Best Quality to slow down the feed rate.... Using lesser quality and the machine hogs out the cut quickly in lesser quality... Yes, it takes longer..... but it slows the machine down...

So go and do your homework and read all the Tips and Tricks and see what you learn about setting up your project on a Sled or Carrier Board to make better use of the wood and the Sled or Carrier having the extra 4 inches on each end to always stay under the rollers...

And with the hardwood you are doing a Cut Path.... Limit the depth to something like .2 or less.... I use .27 for pine... Never break bits....

Your Y error could just be the Feed Rate too.... Just TOO fast for the Cutting Bit to clear a path....

Welcome and Good Luck,

AL

Looking closer at your pictures.... The Carve Region looks the same for the left and right area.. How did you draw them? With lines?

I am with Ask Bud who will chime in here in the next few hours... and ASK.... Post your .MPC.... We want to see how you setup your processes... That could be part of the problem.....

AL

[AskBud]

Right On Al!

I've send a PM to LHR to see what happened to the ordering page for Carbide bits. The 1/16" Cutting Bit seems to be lost. I'll bet it will be back soon!
AskBud

[jerryherb]

Thanks for the reply Al, Bud,

I am using a sled that is about 18" long, by 10" wide and 1.25 deep with masking tape on both sides and always select stay under rollers. I use splints and hot glue to hold the project board in the sled and it seems to keep it in place quite well. i clean the machine thoroughly after every project. i found out that attaching a small toner collector vacuum to the muffler hole pretty much eliminates the RPM errors, however i rarely still get them when cutting poplar. the wood in pictures is oak and i set the depth of cut for all cuts via the control panel on the machine at .125 per pass, but im not sure if project designer overrides it as i usually let the machine run its course as im doing something else. I know it takes a few passes to cut a 1/4" board to size during control panel issued operations (cut, miter, etc.). I also noticed that on some projects, when routing takes a few passes, it does not precisely go over the same spot; you can see how many passes it took by the tool marks on the finished piece. i usually cut the projects at "best" setting. the inner square in this project is created by carving out the middle and then routing the perimeter of the carve region. the rest are rectangles, squares, lines with all vertices manually attached at same exact lengths to the board ends/centers (attachments removed prior to cutting). MPC of this particular project in the pictures is attached. When the machine was refurbished the counters were reset so i really dont know how many actual hours are on it. how do i check if the bearings need service, and wouldn't that cause random "off-course events" instead of at precise lengths of cut after changing direction from x to y? BTW, the bit broke because of my mistake. somehow i missed insert carving not cutting 1/16 bit, so it was not caused by the machine going haywire.

While i have your attention, is there a way to attach one vertex to another so that if i move one object in the project others would follow its vertices? im not talking about resize of project as a whole but for example if i were to move or change length of the line with drill holes at its ends (as in the mpc attached), is there a way to attach drill hole centers to the ends of the line and have them follow adjustments of the line aspects?

thanks!

[AskBud]

Thanks for the reply Al, Bud,

I am using a sled that is about 18" long, by 10" wide and 1.25 deep with masking tape on both sides and always select stay under rollers. I use splints and hot glue to hold the project board in the sled and it seems to keep it in place quite well. i clean the machine thoroughly after every project. i found out that attaching a small toner collector vacuum to the muffler hole pretty much eliminates the RPM errors, however i rarely still get them when cutting poplar. the wood in pictures is oak and i set the depth of cut for all cuts via the control panel on the machine at .125 per pass, but I'm not sure if project designer overrides it as i usually let the machine run its course as I'm doing something else. I know it takes a few passes to cut a 1/4" board to size during control panel issued operations (cut, miter, etc.). I also noticed that on some projects, when routing takes a few passes, it does not precisely go over the same spot; you can see how many passes it took by the tool marks on the finished piece. i usually cut the projects at "best" setting. the inner square in this project is created by carving out the middle and then routing the perimeter of the carve region. the rest are rectangles, squares, lines with all vertices manually attached at same exact lengths to the board ends/centers (attachments removed prior to cutting). MPC of this particular project in the pictures is attached. When the machine was refurbished the counters were reset so i really dont know how many actual hours are on it. how do i check if the bearings need service, and wouldn't that cause random "off-course events" instead of at precise lengths of cut after changing direction from x to y? BTW, the bit broke because of my mistake. somehow i missed insert carving not cutting 1/16 bit, so it was not caused by the machine going haywire.

While i have your attention, is there a way to attach one vertex to another so that if i move one object in the project others would follow its vertices? I'm not talking about resize of project as a whole but for example if i were to move or change length of the line with drill holes at its ends (as in the mpc attached), is there a way to attach drill hole centers to the ends of the line and have them follow adjustments of the line aspects?

thanks!
Jerry,
First, let's reconsider the hot glue as your holding device. It does not seem secure enough, unless the pocket in your sled exactly fits the project stock. My "Download" link, below, has a lesson on a Multi-Use Sled that may give you ideas for a better, or additional, holding method.

Second, you should be setting your MAX-Pass-Depth in Designer, not at the machine. The MPC takes control!

Last, At this point there is no way to attach one vector to another as you would like.

My guess is that the stress on the 1/16 cutting bit may go away with my 2nd point, and the rethinking of point #1 may help as well.

let us know how you make out.
AskBud

[lynnfrwd]

Right On Al!

I've send a PM to LHR to see what happened to the ordering page for Carbide bits. The 1/16" Cutting Bit seems to be lost. I'll bet it will be back soon!
AskBud


The 1/16" cutting bit is temporarily out of stock. We will get them back on the store as soon as we have them.

[liquidguitars]

The way you layout in designer and build sleds is important. Why people continue to layout a MPC without including the sled layout is part of the issue. Building a sled with small end blocks will snap bits.

[jerryherb]

the sled does have a pocket just a tad bigger than project board and at the depth flush with it. the hot glue and wood splints hold it in there well ( i need to use a hammer and a dull chisel to get tho board out after its done cutting (cut finger holes all the way through the sled to help push it out and the fingers alone cant get the board out after the hot glue cures). I will look at your sled lesson, however i had no issues thus far with the board getting dislodged. i will set the depth in the designer and cut another one of these in "optimal mode" once i get a replacement bit and share the results. however, i dont think its going to resolve the issue. has anyone looked at the MPC to see if there is anything that would cause the wierdness im experiencing prior to ripping the machine open to replace the bearings? thanks!

[liquidguitars]

yes I just looked at it and I also looked at Buds sled.

[AskBud]

the sled does have a pocket just a tad bigger than project board and at the depth flush with it. the hot glue and wood splints hold it in there well ( i need to use a hammer and a dull chisel to get tho board out after its done cutting (cut finger holes all the way through the sled to help push it out and the fingers alone cant get the board out after the hot glue cures). I will look at your sled lesson, however i had no issues thus far with the board getting dislodged. i will set the depth in the designer and cut another one of these in "optimal mode" once i get a replacement bit and share the results. however, i dont think its going to resolve the issue. has anyone looked at the MPC to see if there is anything that would cause the wierdness im experiencing prior to ripping the machine open to replace the bearings? thanks!
If, after you make your MPC setting changes the problem still exists, I would delete the cutting bit rectangle that cleans your carve area. I suspect that it is the source of any other problem (not the machine).
AskBud

[jerryherb]

my sled seems very sturdy, and stays under both rollers at all times. it is a solid piece of 12x2x18 with a carved out region just a tad bigger than the boards i use to cut into (3.5x5.5x.25). the "breaking bits" part of it has nothing to do with the issue i am trying to resolve (precise and deliberate "notching" while cutting in y direction). i used the wrong bit for the job because i must be dyslexic (the machine asked for a carving bit and i inserted a cutting bit in it) hence it snapped.

[jerryherb]

Bud,
That sounds like a compromise, i really would rather rout than carve as it takes less time. i need it to be the same size at the bottom as it is on top of the carve region hence the clean up rout. there is a reason why LHR sells the decorative bits for routing. if the machine cant handle routing, than its kind of useless to sell the routing bits and allow routing in the software :( can someone run one of these widgets in my MPC on their machine and tell me if the notching in the pictures (post #1) comes out on their machine as well? (bits needed 1/16 cutter and 1/16 carver)

[AskBud]

I've deleted the back carving, and set Max-Pass-Depths on the "Cutting Bit", and I'll set the card to Optimal.
I've got to remove the QC adapter from my 1/16" cutting bit as I've never used it since I changed to the CT chuck. That will take a few minutes before I start my 1st test.
I'll post, in about an hour.
AskBud

[Digitalwoodshop]

WOW for a first few posts looking at your reply to my suggestions I see you are really an Advanced User.... Way ahead of me....

From the post, you are doing all the right things from machine settings to use of tape and blocking on your sled.... WOW.... Good Job....

So if we take away the Software issues..... By doing a simple test.... Draw a rectangle the same size as your carve region and just assign a bit to it and a depth of .125 and let it make 1 pass around in hard wood and look at the results.... Do this without a sled.... This takes out the Software and the possible of the project shifting from side to side on the hot glue.... Not Likely but there is a big force at play as the machine pushes it's way through the wood.

If you still get the issues then we need to look at the Y gear box.

This will be an inspection and adjustment... Remove the right side panel to access spring loaded screw for the right side of return for the Y belt and remove the screw. Remove the screw on top of the belt return and cut motor.

With the belt loose grab the whole head and pull and bush looking for a loose bearing on the rails either Y or Z. Should have a solid feel.....

Next unplug the Y Motor and remove the whole assembly. Remove the back of the Y Motor Encoder and inspect for dust and that the clear disk is stuck to the motor shaft and is not free to spin.

Remove the clear plastic cover from the gearbox and the C Clip from the back of the big plastic gear. Remove the gear. Checking for side to side motion indicating bad bearings... In your case I would just plan to replace the 2 bearings 5 mm x 11 mm x 5 mm. The US part numbers are posted in a few threads. I bought a 10 pack for about $30.00 delivered. Clean and reassemble....

Inspect Y Belt and bracket holding the belt to the Y for snugness... I broke my first Y belt at about 1000 hours... Because the LHR Tech has the software to reset the hours counter on the machine, you could have a 1000 hour machine and not know it..... Like a Used Car Salesman resetting the Odometer on a car using a drill to run the counter backwards...... I am not so sure I like that ability used to make money off unsuspecting buyers.... IF that is what the LHR Tech did Moonlighting as a Referbisher.... Making money off of his knowledge and ability to set the counter's back.... There could be a Ethics Violation here..... Hours is Hours... Where did you buy it? eBay?

Call LHR with the Serial Number and ask the history of the machine.... See if that sheds any light on how old it was when reset.... IF it was..... What were the Hours when you got it..... EVERY machine I have ever heard of has had hours on it when arrived new from factory testing.... There was a Thread on it back in 2007.... My new machine had 11 hours when I got it.... If it had Zero Zero hours that is just wrong.... Call me the Ethics Police....

I have got some Swamp..... I mean Water Front Property for you in Flordia..... And this car was owned by a little old lady and Only driven to Church on Sunday and the Grocery Store once a month.....


Let us know...

AL

[AskBud]

44048440474404644045TEST-1
OK, as I stated earlier, I modified the Max-Pass-Depth and set to Optimal when loading the card.
I see no problems, and I stopped after the unit finished the 1st outer cut-out (no need to test further.

Once you do the same, you should be home free (OR follow Al's advice on more testing and repair of the machine. I presume that you have no wiggle, in any direction, of the truck or chuck) and that your wood is secure.

If you look at your set of pictures the imperfection is the same on each piece, albeit a mirror. In my pics you see no flaw. Sorry for the quality of the pics, I guess my photo ability need some practice on close-ups!
AskBud

[jerryherb]

thanks for all your help, i will try running the MPC through the machine again per Al's and Bud's suggestions and get back to you all. if that fails im going to dig into the machine over the weekend and see what it all looks like in there. Bud, your pictures are a little bit blurry, hence its a little hard to tell, but are all the interior rounded 90 degree turns (corners) the same diameter? thanks!

[liquidguitars]

the sled and your layout are not the same. The CW will cut precise but you will need to make a good sled and follow some simple logic. let me know down the road it you can't make your system work.




If you look at your set of pictures
I can not see anything but soft blurs.

[AskBud]

thanks for all your help, i will try running the MPC through the machine again per Al's and Bud's suggestions and get back to you all. if that fails im going to dig into the machine over the weekend and see what it all looks like in there. Bud, your pictures are a little bit blurry, hence its a little hard to tell, but are all the interior rounded 90 degree turns (corners) the same diameter? thanks!
YES! All interior corners and edges are equal. There are no bumps on any edge.
AskBud

[mtylerfl]

... Sorry for the quality of the pics, I guess my photo ability need some practice on close-ups!
AskBud

Hi Bud,

You may want to check to see if your camera has a Macro feature. Most do, nowdays.

Mine has two Macro settings...one for so-called "closeups" that yields sharp focus for between about one to three or four feet away (that's the setting I use for taking pics of boards for my tutorials - although I don't think it's a true "macro", but that's what the camera menu calls it). Then it has another Macro setting for really close-up pics about an inch to several inches away (what I call a "true" macro setting). Funny, you have the opposite problem from my own...I often forget to disengage the macro setting when I'm taking "normal" pictures so I get out of focus results more than I should, too!

Frederick is the one to ask about photo taking tips, since he is the expert! He was kind enough to explain to me why many of my "close" photos had lens distortion and how to avoid or minimize it when using a "cheap" digital camera like mine!

[AskBud]

Let's see if this is better!
AskBud
44079

[Kenm810]

AskBud,

Sorry still out of Focus,

[jerryherb]

Follow-up:

I took the machine's cover off and cleaned the crap out of it. i found no play in the bearings that move the head in y and z direction. I noticed a very slight play in the gear boxes when reversing direction, slightly more in y-axis, and dont know if this is normal or whether there should be not play all. Again they are very slight and i switched the big wheel plastic cogs that run the belts (between y and z) to see if it would make any difference. After reassembly i ran a simple 4 square cut path job in pine on a 2 foot board (stayed under rollers, snap to grid, mirrored across y axis, pressure at about 83lbs, masking tape applied, optimal setting, .125 per pass with 1/8 bit). The job came out the same as the original problem. i closely watched the job this time, as well as recorded the best i could and posted on youtube (links below).

Observations:
the head slows down prior to every turn and speeds up after at about 3/8 inch each (this is exactly when the snipes are formed, at slow down and speed up in y direction). prior to changing direction from x to y, it jerks (speeds up for a split second, and goes back to slower speed); after changing the direction at the point of speeding up again (in y direction) i can see a jerk of the belts and the snipe is created. as it reaches the other corner and changes the head speed again the belts jerk in the other direction and another snipe is created (see the original pictures). it only does it as it cuts in y-direction; x-driection cuts are smooth. also the upper left corner of the square (panel being the bottom) is way wider than the others, and the lower right is much tighter than the others. Also the head does not slow down at all when reaching lower right direction change from y to x.

Has anyone experienced anything like this? Is this the x-drive, how do i get at it and what do i need to fix it? please see the videos for both the head movement and belt jerking. thanks!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6A-lGFVQMME
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUgivRglcK8

[Digitalwoodshop]

Well the videos help..... What you are seeing is the 1st gear and 2nd gear Feed Rate for a Cut Path..... This is on LHR's "Yes they want something else..." List... During a Cut Path like that "I" would like to be able to select in the depth of cut menu to stay in 1st gear the whole time.... Like you pointed out... The 2nd gear feed rate leaves a less desirable cut.... Not to mention how many $40.00 bits snapped when the cutting feed rate sped up in hardwood. This is the same result I was seeing cutting my plastic tags on the carrier board using a 1/16 end mill and depth of cut without tabs using double sided tape.

The FIX came form LYNN here on the forum... In MY case I design the rectangles using the 1/16 end mill bit and NO Tabs and NOT using cut path but use DEPTH OF CUT.... The tabs could fracture off my plastic making for bad edges. The double stick tape holds the piece in place.

SO back to the plan.... Design it in 1/16 inch for depth of cut.... When done select all the cut paths and change the bit to the 1/4 ball nose bit. In your case you will still cut with the 1/8 inch bit but ASSIGN the 1/4 inch ball noes. This locks the feed rate into 1st gear for the whole cut. The depth of cut will change when you select the new bit, so remember to change it....

You will need to leave a skin at the bottom of your blocks to hold it in place... Fail to do that and the wood will move and pinch the bit and snap it.... So leave a skin at the bottom or use double stick tape.

Good Luck,

AL

[jerryherb]

Well, i tore off the bottom and side panels as per instructions on the carvewright website. it appears that there is a lot of play between primary and secondary gear, and by messing with mechanics i have proven that it is enough to cause the belts to be able to jerk during speed/direction change. I also notice that the primary gear has a crack in it (between the screw hole and the brass embedded gear. since my somewhat retrofitted type A needs a new x-drive gear box, i hope the new replacement C-type design will fit and fix this problem (old system = two parts MWM A2036 and MWM A2049, new = one part MWM A2129). I hope its available for purchase as i can replace it myself and do not want to have to send it in. I am also confused as to the shifting gears phenomenon. there is not any kind of transmission system in the x-drive gearbox and the only speed adjustment is the code on the controller telling the motor to speed up or slow down as far as i can tell by looking at it. any staff members care to chime in? thanks!

[Digitalwoodshop]

In your video you can clearly see the turns are at a slow feed rate.... then the feed rate speeds up..... then slows down at the next corner.....

I call it 1st Gear and 2nd Gear for Simplicity.... The Feed Rate is actually controlled by the SOFTWARE and no shifting gear boxes... SERVO SPEED... Slow or FAST.....

Lets hope the cracked gear fixes the problem.....

Good Luck...

AL

[jerryherb]

Further attempts to repair still futile!
Just to reiterate the original problem: the belts jerk and cause an uneven cut when engaging/disengaging the "2nd gear" or high speed head movement, but only in y-direction.

I replaced the x-drive gear set and the problem persists.

the next thing in line is the motor itself; swapped the x-motor with y-motor, problem still persists.

Does anyone know what x-termination board does and if that would have an effect on the x-motor jerking while the y-motor engages/disengages high speed movement?

x-termination board is part number MWM A2074 which can be found on page 7 of the parts manual: http://www.carvewright.com/2010CWweb/service/Maintenence/CW_parts_list_manual.pdf

any advice greatly appreciated! thanks!

[Digitalwoodshop]

The X Termination Board does 2 things... It Passes through the X Servo Signals and has the Q1 Transistor that turns on and off the Cut Motor.....

This jerking could be your head pressure it TOOOOOOO High...... I believe there is a PDF that has the instructions for using a bathroom scale.... A simple thing to do is crank off 1/16 of a turn to reduce the pressure.....

Another thing I just remembered... The Brass Roller between the belts needs to be moved away from the rubber belt by drilling or filing the holes oblong... IF this is NOT DONE.... Then the belts bulge when you crank the head down and the rubber belt touching the Brass Roller could be your problem... IT CAUSES JERKING......

The guy doing the Referb might have just BENT the Roller Bracket or not thought it was needed..... That topic has been posted here before... Me... I like the Sand Paper Belts.... Gives me things to work on.....

So I think the problem is the Brass Roller needs to be moved more..... This could come down to a case of the "Botched Rubber Belt Change Out"... "

Look at the pictures... Check your board for Burning.... The Broken C1 just effects the starting of the Cut Motor... I have 3 out of 4 broken C1's.... Before the ROCK.... Whole Lot of Shaking going on.... QC.

AL

[jerryherb]

i checked the pressure and its continuously recording between 78 and 80 lbs. I also checked the rubber belts install manual and all the washers/spacers appear to have been installed. I did the "paper pinch" test (step 30 of the rubber belt upgrade manual) and it successfully passed. tomorrow i will try some kind of clear media to see if there is any interference between the belts and roller, however the belts appear to be installed correctly. the x-termination board also looks fine. Could it be firmware issue with A machine and the controller losing it? does anyone have the first release of project designer i can try? im at loss here, i guess the only thing i can try is to fool the machine with the 3/16 bit trick, however that is a BS work around, and im disappointed in the carvewright's software limitations. there needs to be a way in software to slow the machine down/keep it running at low head speed for EVERY bit without exceptions, as well as vertex attachment for resizing the route designs. not to mention the ability of what order the user would prefer things to be cut. Manual control of the head in x-y-z would be nice as well, and im sure it can be done via the "serial" port on the back of the system. I think that is what im going to work on next, or maybe i just need to get me a real CNC with mach3 ....

[liquidguitars]

Could it be firmware issue with A machine and the controller losing it?


no


the belts jerk and cause an uneven cut when engaging/disengaging the "2nd gear"
or high speed head movement, but only in y-direction.

Sounds like a few things like a worn y pack, dirty bearings 8 ea, uneven sled, loose chuck parts dull bit, y belt tension. Plastic gear chips in the x drive. I assume all the bearings are tight, the truck should not wiggle at all.

[jerryherb]

Sounds like a few things like a worn y pack, dirty bearings 8 ea, uneven sled, loose chuck parts dull bit, y belt tension. Plastic gear chips in the x drive. I assume all the bearings are tight, the truck should not wiggle at all.

All these things have been checked; the head is tight, the bearings appear clean and tight, y-belt is tensioned, bit is brand new, x-drive has just been replaced, the x and y motors have been swapped with no change in behavior. Sled is taken out of equation as it performs these "cut errors" on any size and thickness board without the use of the sled just the same. the problem is caused by belts jerking, yet there is almost no play in the x-drive gear set. it seems the controller is sending deliberate instructions to the x-motor causing a quirk in x-direction (belt jerk) when the y-direction head movement changes speed, hence the firmware question. I have a few more variables to check and will post a response when complete. in the meantime please throw ideas at me as i am desperate to try anything to get this fixed. thanks!

[Digitalwoodshop]

I think that is what im going to work on next, or maybe i just need to get me a real CNC with mach3 ....

I agree... Your Hobby Machine is never going to live up to your Industrial Dream. Turn in your 2K machine for the $20K dream.

"BS" work around and Carvewright's Software Limitations just disappoint you so you will never be happy with this Hobby Machine.

Tell us when you get your industrial CNC.

Happy Hobby User,

AL

[jerryherb]

Al,
Judging by your latest pictures (especially the first one) and previous feedback i see that your machine is not mis-behaving like mine. its not the machines limitations i am trying to overcome here, but its inability to route a straight line. eventually i will get a more expensive machine, but wanted to get a taste of CNC and gain some experience with an entry system without spending a fortune on something i may not enjoy. Software issues, btw, are not that difficult to fix, and would make it a lot more versatile, productive and attract more customers, something at least LHR would surely enjoy. If LHR would make their software open-source it would make this system more popular than Marlboro cigarettes.

[liquidguitars]

I do think it's a good idea to port the software, I sure LHR will at some point, I like to see a version that would compete with the big boy software.

[jerryherb]

further i did the testing with clean power running through a UPS AC filter with nothing else on the circuit and the same results transpired.
again created an MPC with 4 sets of squares about 1.5" on the side. the cut depth set at .31 with .1" max depth per pass with 1/16 cutter bit in pine and all the squares came out clean. however during careful observation of the project it appeared as the machine was running the router head in counter-clockwise direction while cutting vectors, which is a little odd as all previous closed figure vector cuts would run clockwise. there also was no y-axis head movement speed change during cutting as perhaps the job was designed for and ran with a thin bit and in "optimize" mode. ran the project again on the other side of the board and it also performed exactly the same cuts, no belt jerking occurred and the square cuts were clean.
I will experiment further and update with results. thanks!

[Digitalwoodshop]

Interesting... Counter Clockwise.... I have never see that... Always Clockwise around the vector cut.... But I am still using 1.177 I believe...

With my use of the 1/4 inch bull nose bit to keep the feed rate slow but using the 1/16 bit gives me a consistent slow clean cut...

Good Luck and lets hear more of your testing... I would love to see a you tube video of the reverse or counter clockwise vector....

Any chance the UPS is causing that?

AL

[jerryherb]

Here is the excerpt from the video of the counter-clockwise cut made by my CW (1.179):

http://www.youtube.com/user/TecWrec?feature=mhee#p/a/u/0/dKz6VUAaYVI

the first four squares (two big two small) are all cut counter-clockwise, the next four (created by mirroring of the original 4 across y-axis) are cut clockwise. MPC of the project attached. this is the first time i noticed it do that, weird or normal?

Secondly, i now have a length measurement accuracy issue; calibration set to 875 (lowest i could set it to) and still .9" short along 48" board. is the o-ring the only device responsible for the proper measurement, and can i get a 1/4" ID x 3/8” OD anywhere, or is it special order?

44546

44547

[Digitalwoodshop]

I would clean the board sensor as it measures the return reflective light..... Plus try it again and note the reading then try it again with the room lights dimmed down... Trust me... It could make a difference.... Room Light could cause a early detect....

The O Ring has been discussed a few times.... My feeling it that is is Metric and smaller and people buying Home Depot or Ace Hardware O rings are getting a thicker ring and this has effected the rotation of the brass roller..... Not by much.... but if you are measuring the board to locate in the center then you are Gambling that it works correct.... IN MY OPINION all projects should be designed "Place On END". That way.... 1. Less wear and tear of measuring the board length TWICE and 2. Measuring off the Right side of Designer and the top of the board every time gets repeatable results... In my opinion it is silly to use place on center....

I also believe that a thicker O ring on the Brass Roller makes if more of a FRICTION drive as opposed to a Friction AND the Brass Teeth...

AND when the board pops our from under the roller on either end, the brass roller could skip or loose contact slightly with the board tipping up.... How are your in feed and out feed rollers set.....? AND.... Use Masking Tape.... My Stock is dropping...

AL

[jerryherb]

the teeth are definitely leaving nice bite marks in the tape. the outfeed rollers are both adjusted just a hair below the board. i also ran another test project where i have a set of parallel lines same size and distance away from the y-axis each of which are cut in multiple passes. the further away from the panel they are cut the closer to the front of the board they are cut, which is really weird. its like the machine does not seem able to go back to the same spot in the x-direction.

have you watched the video of counter-clockwise cutting?

[jerryherb]

I told the o-ring "forget you". since removal of this rubber POS and proper calibration i have been getting correct, constant and multiple readings on all the boards i measured (between 48" and 18") within .002". i have a "C" sensor in my "A" CW and run it just with the brass teeth (no rubber) biting on the masking tape. has anyone tried this before? i will see how it works out during cutting and if this will help with the rubber belt jerking and loss of board tracking. will keep you posted.

[AskBud]

the teeth are definitely leaving nice bite marks in the tape. the outfeed rollers are both adjusted just a hair below the board. i also ran another test project where i have a set of parallel lines same size and distance away from the y-axis each of which are cut in multiple passes. the further away from the panel they are cut the closer to the front of the board they are cut, which is really weird. its like the machine does not seem able to go back to the same spot in the x-direction.

have you watched the video of counter-clockwise cutting?
Just for the heck of it, attach this particular MPC, so we can see your test design.
AskBud

[liquidguitars]

i have been getting correct, constant and multiple readings on all the boards
i measured (between 48" and 18") within .002". i have a "C" sensor in my "A" CW
and run it just with the brass teeth (no rubber) biting on the masking tape. has
anyone tried this before?


Sweet.. regarding the AUX roller I ran it without the o ring on my old A machine before, but i think it's better to use one. one thing to look for is the belts hitting the AUX I even seen the unit run backward at one point due to a dirty AUX to Belt interaction. good to see your running now..