Setting Up a Carve for Red Oak

[Alan Malmstrom]

Now I notice that carving in draft mode seems to make less passes thus resulting in a faster carve time (less back and forth wear and tear but more torch on the motor and flex shaft). So I'm assuming that the machine makes smaller or shallower (not as deap a cut) when I use the better or normal mode. Does anybody know if this is the case?

Im getting ready to do a new project and I'm going to use red oak board. So since different woods cut differently depending on their hardness and fiber legth or characteristics of the wood or what not what would the best setting be for red oak. Opinions may vary but I'm interested in hearing some.

Also I was looking at my web site today and remembered that I have instructions on how to build your own TV antenna if anybody is interested in that kind of thing here is the link: http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html

[mtylerfl]

Hello Alan,

Red Oak has a tendency to chip/tearout on thinner raised areas. To help reduce that tendency, I recommend that you use only BEST or OPTIMAL when you upload to the card (if the design has a lot of fine detail - definitely use OPTIMAL). You may find you still have areas with some tear out. Open-grained wood (like Red Oak) are simply prone to that anyway (White Oak is not as open-grained as the Red - less prone to chipping/tearing). Fortunately, Red Oak tear out is fairly easy to repair and/or hide, for the most part. Of course, the nature of the design you are carving will have a large bearing on how much of a problem it may or may not be. Hope that helps!

[Alan Malmstrom]

[QUOTE=mtylerfl;151520]
Red Oak has a tendency to chip/tearout on thinner raised areas.

Oh I see. Well there is a little piece of raised area that is about 2" long and 1/16" wide and sticks up about 1/16" I will try to make that a little thicker in width before I carve. I'm caarving a picture frame and will miter the edges to fit together.

[CarverJerry]

Interesting concept on your TV antenna.....may just have to give that a try....thanks for sharing

CJ

[mtylerfl]

[QUOTE=mtylerfl;151520]
Red Oak has a tendency to chip/tearout on thinner raised areas.

Oh I see. Well there is a little piece of raised area that is about 2" long and 1/16" wide and sticks up about 1/16" I will try to make that a little thicker in width before I carve. I'm caarving a picture frame and will miter the edges to fit together.

Hi Alan,

Perhaps you already know this...A handy feature in Designer that helps reduce chipping/tear out is the "Draft" (menu item: Carving/Draft/None/Small/Medium/Large). I often apply a "Small" or "Medium" Draft on patterns. The Draft creates an angled ramp at the vertical 'walls' of pattern elements. This allows the bit to travel more gently up/down during the carving process, rather than plunging, so chipping is less likely.

[JDPratt]

Even though I hate red oak, I do a lot of carving in it (it is what they want). Definitely use the draft in designer. I never use less than a small draft in the finer details on red oak and most of the time I use medium.

[JMD]

Looks like this could also be used to increase the range of your WI FI network. Use it as a reseaver antenna.

Now I notice that carving in draft mode seems to make less passes thus resulting in a faster carve time (less back and forth wear and tear but more torch on the motor and flex shaft). So I'm assuming that the machine makes smaller or shallower (not as deap a cut) when I use the better or normal mode. Does anybody know if this is the case?

Im getting ready to do a new project and I'm going to use red oak board. So since different woods cut differently depending on their hardness and fiber legth or characteristics of the wood or what not what would the best setting be for red oak. Opinions may vary but I'm interested in hearing some.

Also I was looking at my web site today and remembered that I have instructions on how to build your own TV antenna if anybody is interested in that kind of thing here is the link: http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html[/QUOTE]

[Alan Malmstrom]

I was wondering about that draft option. I will try the draft medium to see how well that works. I also have used the bit optimization set to best. Does that make any difference I wonder. In my head I'm thinking that these two things are kind of the same but I don't know. Thanks for the help.

As for the antenna this design is good for picking up the higher frequency digital signal from 11 to 66. But the size can also pick up the digital analog signal range that some areas have now from 2 to 11. http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html (http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html) It works best in the attick. I can pick up all the stations in the Chicago area clear as a bell. You can also bend coat hanger wire in this shape and it works good too.

[mtylerfl]

Hello,

The Draft setting for applying to patterns (not to be confused with the Draft Quality setting when uploading to the memory card) does not decrease the number of passes - it just creates the ramps.

The number of passes is determined by the quality setting when uploading to the memory card. The higher the quality, the more passes. This functions exactly the same as the Step-Over percentage used when creating toolpaths for other CNC machines. The lower the step over percentage, the higher the quality of carve (and the longer it will take).

When I set the final Finish Pass for a "brand-x" CNC, I'll set the Step Over percentage at 5% to 8%, of the bit diameter. We're doing the same thing on our CarveWright machines, but it happens automatically for us...DRAFT quality is a high Step Over percentage (fewer passes farther apart = lower-quality)...OPTIMAL quality is a low Step Over percentage (more passes closer together = higher quality). Again, don't confuse the Draft feature in Designer for applying to patterns with the DRAFT quality setting when uploading to the memory card. Totally different functions!

Yes, by all means do assign "Bit Optimization: BEST" to patterns before uploading to your card. Great-quality patterns will benefit immensely from this (more of the intended detail will become visible). Be aware that some patterns (especially home-made ones) may not benefit at all from that. In fact, they can actually look worse because of accentuating any defects/artifacts within the pattern itself. Always try the various Bit Optimization settings though. The on-screen preview in Designer does a great job of showing you what you will get when carved - try the settings and look - if the pattern looks better, use it...if the pattern looks worse, set it to NONE (the default).

Hope that helps!

EDIT: A photo might help illustrate the concept. I am carving an item right now on a "brand-x" - first ran a roughing pass at 50% step over with a 1/4" ballnose bit...took about 25 minutes. Now running the final finish pass with a 1/8" bit set at 5% step over...this will take about 3 hours or so. The photo shows the two areas as an extreme comparison of step over amounts and times.

[liquidguitars]

That's cool I think it's time i be joining you soon.

[mtylerfl]

Hi LG,

All CNC's have their place and I'm enjoying learning something new every day. I really love the CarveWright machines! You certainly have done miracles with yours! (That's why I affectionately call mine the "Miracle Machines"!) Pretty tough to equal the value and ease of use of a CarveWright! (so far, no one has, IMO)

[liquidguitars]

You certainly have done miracles with yours!.


yes I made a lot of firsts ever as a pioneer on this machine, but your only as good as your last gig. < Wink >

[mtylerfl]

Hi LG,

We owe a lot to your pioneering and I know we'll be learning a lot more from you! The phenomonal work you've already done speaks for itself - you're not "just as good as your last gig" - you're just ALWAYS GOOD, man!

[Alan Malmstrom]

You guys are going to make me cry. Well back to the subject.

I did play around with the draft and bit optimization under the carve menu and saw that there is a lot of difference on screen when I change these options. The bit optimization function seems to make the same kind of change as what I might see if I were to manually add an unsharp mask filter in Photoshop. The draft seems to do the same kind of function as the find edges and blur filter would do in photoshop. I'm getting to know a little more every day. Thanks for the tips mtylerfl.

Also I found that there is a store called Owl Hardwoods that is close by to my area and I just might go over there and pick up some white oak since it is less open grained as the red oak and not quite as hard. Easier sanding.

[liquidguitars]

Sorry Alan..

White oak should carve a little better, point the grain into the unit for a little smoother finish...

[Alan Malmstrom]

Sorry Alan..

White oak should carve a little better, point the grain into the unit for a little smoother finish...

I was up last night thinking about what open grain might mean and I thought about how when you cut a piece of wood in half against the grain the ends will be a little bumpy and hard to sand. This bumpyness is probably due to tear out I guess. Maybe what open grain does is tear out more on certain kinds of wood like red oak than others like white oak etc. Am I correct on this interpretation of the term "open grain"?

I'm not sure what it means to point the grain into the unit but that got me thinking about the tree ring like effect in the wood. I'm not sure but I thought I heard someone descrive these rings as cup or cupping. I've heard on a youtube video people say that you should carve wood with the ring facing down or the cup facing down I think they said. Does anybody know the correct type of phrasing to describe this and what the best way to carve a piece is like cup facing up or down?

By the way anybody who is interested in making the free antenna: http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html (http://alanmalmstrom.homestead.com/index.html) I also want to point you to this web site: www.antennaweb.org (http://www.antennaweb.org) which is good for finding the antenna towers in your area and what frequencies the various stations are using.

Alan

[liquidguitars]

I'm not sure what it means to point the grain into the unit but that got me
thinking about the tree ring like effect in the wood.




Hi Alan,

I point the grain direction into the front of the machine for cleaner carving results.. see image below:

http://liquidguitars.com/assets/images/CWGraindirectionR001.jpg

[Alan Malmstrom]

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words. Thanks liquidguitars!

I just got back from the wood store and I found out what open grained means. It means that there are tiny holes in the wood. These small holes help the wood to absorb the stain and help to give contrast between the light areas and dark areas of stained wood. The dark areas absorb more stain thus making them darker. A lot of open grain in a piece of wood can lead to tear out by the carving bit when carved because its not held together as well as a tight grain or maybe it is called a closed grain.

I also learned at the wood supply store about the three basic types of board cuts: 1)quarter sawn 2)Flat sawn and 3)Rift sawn. Quarter sawn has the ring marks going almost straight from top to bottom. Flat sawn is like a smily face ring mark if looked at from the end of the board. And rift sawn is halfway in between the two kind of like maybe twenty to thirty degee angle rings. And I supose that the best way to carve a board with the CarveWright is different depending on the ring angle. So each peice of wood is unique in how it should be carved. Am I wright on this?

[JDPratt]

You might want to check this out. It is an invaluable tool when starting to learn woodworking.

[mtylerfl]

Hi Alan,

I point the grain direction into the front of the machine for cleaner carving results.. see image below:


Hey LG,

Did you make the 3D model of the CW machine? That's really cool!

[liquidguitars]

Hey LG,

Did you make the 3D model of the CW machine? That's really cool!

Yes I set that up when i was going to teach some classes on guitarmaking.

[Deolman]

LG, did you start with the PC version of Lightwave 3D or the Amiga version?

[liquidguitars]

Amiga 500!!! with a 68010 chip from Motorola !!!

[Deolman]

I kinda thought so. Are you aware commodore is coming out now with a new PC and has licensed the Amiga software? This may get interesting. BTW, I still have a 2K with the Video Toaster.