Help w/ Church Project Please!!

[c6craig]

Hi All,

Looking for all kinds of help here. I may have bit off more than I could chew..

The church asked me to make a new candle stand that sits on the altar. The old one was just glued and screwed MDF with a veneer and is coming apart.

My goal is to carve the attached MPC for the first (outside layer) then do 3 more boards with just the outline cutout, glue them all up and atach to a base. This will give me the 3" thickness that is needed. Then I will use a forster bit to cut holes for the candles to sit in.

So.......first of all I made all my lines for the cutout and couldn't turn it into a cutpath, I could only assign a bit and depth, so now I have no tabs. I tried to select them and and outline like I have seen people suggest but that option is grayed out.

Second problem I have is the pattern itself. If one of the pattern makers wants to take a shot at cleaning this up and putting it for sale I would be glad to pay. I have searched and searched and can't find any Russian Orthodox style crosses to buy. I found what I think is a decent PNG and eliminated the background and imported into pattern editor but this is the best I can come up with. It's very rough and I can't get rid of the hole at the very top.

I also put another line around the inside and set it to carve with the cutting bit to .200 as a type of inlay. I just want to paint that gold so it is kind of bordered, I think I did that part right at least...

So...Anyone up for some help??

Thanks to all in advance...

Craig

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[dbfletcher]

Craig,

In order to use the cutout tool, it has to be a closed object or the endpoint need to be off the board on a open path. In your example, you just need to connect all your line segments in your outter path in to one continuous closed object. I'll connect em for you and respost... but feel free to try it yourself in the meantime.

[dbfletcher]

Here it is with the outer path closed.

[c6craig]

Here it is with the outer path closed.

Thanks Doug, That was helpful. I went ahead and went though it like you said and now I can see what you mean when they attach. I appreciate it. Once I removed the select bit and depth it let me do the cut path.

Now if I can just get someone to take a crack at the pattern I may be in pretty good shape here...

Thanks,
Craig

[dbfletcher]

Sorry craig.. in my haste i missed the last endpoint.. this one is correct

BTW.. the new "toggle end point" in the view menu helps a lot with finding unconnected lines.

[c6craig]

OK I think I am getting this a little bit :)

Can someone look this over and make sure I did it right? I started one from scratch because the dimensions were wrong and I wanted the practice anyway.

1. I made all the outside line segments and arcs and connected them.
2. Once it was one line and it all hightlighted together I turned it into a cut path (made the tabs a minimum of 5 since its a big project I am kinda worried there wouldnt be enough).
3. Did the same line segments and arcs and connected them for the inlay, selected bit as cutting bit and set depth to .200.
4. Dropped my crappy pattern on the board and sized it, added major feathering and draft to try to offset the quality a bit.

I think I am good to go for a test run, still looking for someone to take up the pattern challenge. I dont know if it would be easier to try cleaning up the one I posted or just making one from scratch using mine as a template, but willing to pay...

Thanks again, I really appreciate this - I haven't really tried designing my own stuff yet so this is kinda a first for me. I will admit it is fun learning it though :)

Thanks,
Craig

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[eromran]

Will this one work. Sorry didnt have much time to mess with it. Late nite posted wrong pattern no Maple leaf was my bad. hers the cross

[jaroot]

Will this one work. Sorry didnt have much time to mess with it.

Don't think the Maple Leaf Emblem will quite work. :)

[bjbethke]

Will this work?
Concerning the Orthodox Cross:

The top bar signifies the sign that was placed above Christ's head, reading, "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews." In Orthodox iconography the phrase "King of Glory" is often written on this bar instead.

The center bar is that upon which Christ's arms were stretched and nailed.

The bottom bar signifies the footrest which supported His body.

While there are a variety of pious understandings as to the slanted position of this bar -- even though in earlier Byzantine iconography the bar was generally depicted as being horizontal rather than slanted -- these are of somewhat later origin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarchal_cross#Other_variations

[c6craig]

Thanks guys, those should get me going. I don't think I am going to be able to get ornate enough to be able to do a carve on this. Maybe I can take the metal cross off the old one and attach it to the front of the new stand.

This is the existing one, you can see how detailed it is. I didn't plan on getting this ornate but I don't think I can get away with just an outline either.

I have not used my scanning probe yet....maybe I can get ahold of the existing metal one and scan it. Does anyone know if it will be able to pick up the kind of detail shown on the metal one? And if it will convert to a carve with any decency? I would love to be able to do a carve on this one if I can swing it...the existing metal cross measures around 10" high and 5" wide at the widest point.

Thanks again,
Craig

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[Kenm810]

Hi Graig,

I had a moment to look at your mpc this afternoon,
it should be a great project.

[eromran]

Yes if you could scan that cross you would get quit a bit of detail if its that big.

[bjbethke]

Thanks guys, those should get me going. I don't think I am going to be able to get ornate enough to be able to do a carve on this. Maybe I can take the metal cross off the old one and attach it to the front of the new stand.

This is the existing one, you can see how detailed it is. I didn't plan on getting this ornate but I don't think I can get away with just an outline either.

I have not used my scanning probe yet....maybe I can get ahold of the existing metal one and scan it. Does anyone know if it will be able to pick up the kind of detail shown on the metal one? And if it will convert to a carve with any decency? I would love to be able to do a carve on this one if I can swing it...the existing metal cross measures around 10" high and 5" wide at the widest point.

Thanks again,
Craig

34902

Why don't you just scan that cross, it should make a great scan? I tried to make a MPC from a photo, but a scan would be the best way to go.

[c6craig]

Wow, thanks! That's pretty darn impressive coming of a low res jpeg! I am going to see about getting the cross to scan. I have to find out if it's OK to scan first. I am worried about it being some old cross or something and my probe scratching the heck out of it. If I can't use that one maybe they have one I can use that they dont mind sacrificing to scratches. I have never used the probe yet so I don't know what kind of resolution it picks up or how bad it scratches. I am going to try to get the probe running this evening and do a couple small test scans on some scrap items just to see how it works.

My only worry is getting the adapter off the plastic stem of the probe so it can be used in the Rock or Carvetight, sure would suck to break it..

I am running a test board on this now in some MDF just to see if the dimensions and such work correctly. I will do a glue up for the real thing, but its easier to get a 14" wide board out of a sheet of 3/4 MDF that I had laying around doing nothing. Man on optimal this MDF sure carves some talcum powder for dust!!

Thanks again for everything guys, all this help actually keeps this stuff fun!!

Craig

[AskBud]

Remember that you may select the quality of the scan (Normal or Best). It's done with the keypad, just after you set the start & finish marks. Instead of starting the scan process, you select options with the Up & Down arrows.
AskBud

[stanv77]

craig I haven't got the rock or the carvetight chucks but I made my own chuck which is like the carvetight chuck that LHR came out with. What I do with the scnning probe is put the QC back on just for scanning . I was also scared of breaking the probe if I tried to take the adapter off.

[c6craig]

Thanks for the tips guys, I guess I shouldn't have worried about that part...the set screws came right by hand and the adapter slid right off. LOL I guess thats why you should always check your CW adapters before use, but lucky for me none the less. Hopefully tonight I can slap together a scanning sled (forgot about that little step) and check it out. :)

Craig

[c6craig]

Well I just wanted to take a minute to say thanks again to everyone for the help.

I was able to run a test MPC in MDF just to check it and it came out pretty darn good. Even the cross came out better than I hoped it would. Even if I can't get one of their crosses to scan, I think I may be able to do OK with one of the ones you guys kindly gave me.

It's nice to be able to run a test "prototype" because now I can see the inlay needs to go from a .200 to somewhere around .050, just enough to give me a thin line to paint some gold trim into. All the dimensions look good though.

I also slapped together a quick and dirty scanning sled out of the leftover MDF, 34" L x 13" W with 3" rails. Too late to start playing with the scanning probe tonight as I have an early morning but tomorrow for sure.

Well, onward and forward, hopefully the next post you see on this will be over in the gallery :)

Thanks again everyone!

Craig

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[dbfletcher]

Looking good. Cant wait to see it when you're all finished.

[cestout]

Did anybody look at my "Prayer Candle" project in the store? You could work from that?
Clint

[c6craig]

Did anybody look at my "Prayer Candle" project in the store? You could work from that?
Clint

I am not seeing it under the projects in the store, can you post a link? I went through them twice, I must be going blind :)

Craig

[AskBud]

I am not seeing it under the projects in the store, can you post a link? I went through them twice, I must be going blind :)

Craig
It's in the pattern Depot. Search there for "Prayer".
http://store.carvewright.com/search.php?mode=search&page=1
AskBud

[c6craig]

Thanks Bud, I found it. It should be in projects in my opinion (for what thats worth).

I attempted to "Try" the project to get a closer look at the cross, it let me download it but when I try to open the mpc it says it requires a license to view. I thought "Try" would load it up but it was red and you couldn't upload to a card or anything??

Those would go pretty nice as a secondary project, especially since they mentioned candlesticks when we were talking about this project, but I don't want to spend 25 bucks without a better look...I would like to see if the cross itself will work for me, and also if it is a 2 sided carve.

EDIT - Reading the PDF it says the back will carve first, so I assume it looks the same front and back. Now if I could just get a better look at the cross...

Craig

[AskBud]

Thanks Bud, I found it. It should be in projects in my opinion (for what thats worth).

I attempted to "Try" the project to get a closer look at the cross, it let me download it but when I try to open the mpc it says it requires a license to view. I thought "Try" would load it up but it was red and you couldn't upload to a card or anything??

Those would go pretty nice as a secondary project, especially since they mentioned candlesticks when we were talking about this project, but I don't want to spend 25 bucks without a better look...I would like to see if the cross itself will work for me, and also if it is a 2 sided carve.

EDIT - Reading the PDF it says the back will carve first, so I assume it looks the same front and back. Now if I could just get a better look at the cross...

Craig
I suggest that, in this case, you send an eMail to < patterns@carvewright.com >, as the vendor is listed as "Provider" which I think is the LHR staff.
AskBud

[bjbethke]

Thanks Bud, I found it. It should be in projects in my opinion (for what thats worth).

I attempted to "Try" the project to get a closer look at the cross, it let me download it but when I try to open the mpc it says it requires a license to view. I thought "Try" would load it up but it was red and you couldn't upload to a card or anything??

Those would go pretty nice as a secondary project, especially since they mentioned candlesticks when we were talking about this project, but I don't want to spend 25 bucks without a better look...I would like to see if the cross itself will work for me, and also if it is a 2 sided carve.

EDIT - Reading the PDF it says the back will carve first, so I assume it looks the same front and back. Now if I could just get a better look at the cross...

Craig
I looked at the project; it uses the standard "Basic PTN's" that comes with the Designer program. The PDF shows the front and back of the board.

[c6craig]

Thanks BJB, that's what I wanted to know. I actually have the "decorative crosses collection" from LHR so maybe I will play around a bit when I have some time.

Thanks,
Craig