Could use some advice on 45 mitre cuts

[Griz64]

Well fellas and ladies I am having a little trouble. I have included a picture to show my problems. I have a sears compound mitre saw that tilts to the left. I measured and re-measured several times. I used a protractor, a 45 drawing triangle and a few others that I am not sure of the names of. Anyway I was positive that I had it set up for a proper 45 degree angle. I made the cuts and low and behold I found that I had mastered the 44 degree cut (I didnt actually measure). I need some advice on making a proper 45 degree cut soI dont have this hideous gap at my corners. Suggestions?

[c6craig]

Well fellas and ladies I am having a little trouble. I have included a picture to show my problems. I have a sears compound mitre saw that tilts to the left. I measured and re-measured several times. I used a protractor, a 45 drawing triangle and a few others that I am not sure of the names of. Anyway I was positive that I had it set up for a proper 45 degree angle. I made the cuts and low and behold I found that I had mastered the 44 degree cut (I didnt actually measure). I need some advice on making a proper 45 degree cut soI dont have this hideous gap at my corners. Suggestions?

A couple questions spring to mind...

Are you sure your 45's are off and the box didn't just slip during glue up? A good corner clamping system can help you there. I usually use corner clamps on the bottoms and then a band clamp around the middle-top area. That will show you gaps very easily.

The other thing I have found on my miter saw is that it is tough to get that blade to tilt at exactly 45. Even if you are on the red mark. They have a magnetic angle finder that I got at Lowes for like 10 bucks that has helped me with that. You just stick it right on the blade and it will tell you the exact degree (assuming of course that you are starting with 0, otherwise you have to take the adjustment into account).

45's are tough to get perfect (to me) and from what I have read and seen, the table saw is one of the few ways to consistantly turn out clean 45 cuts.

I am still at the stage of fighting my own, so I am far from an expert, just trying to pass on what I have seen :) Get yourself some wood filler to match the color of your wood, shoot it in with a glue syringe and sand it up clean. That will get your box looking nice while you work on the cuts....

Good luck,

Craig

[c6craig]

The other thing I see while looking closer at the picture is that while the 45's dont look too far off, it looks like the corners are getting some tear out. A backer board might help with that, maybe not tear so much out of the corners....

Plus a good clean sharp blade makes all the difference in the world. Generally those miter saws come with a contractor type saw blade made for ripping ugly cuts in 2x4's...

Craig

[liquidguitars]

I take a dovetail saw and cut the joint with the two miters held together this will remove the waste wood and tighten your joints, the key is to keep pressure on the pre cut miters and use the saw to fine tune the joints.


LG

[Pratyeka]

some low-end miter saws tend to bend while you press down during a cut. Mine does, caused me grief until I notice that. I learned to compensate.

[Eagle Hollow]

Well fellas and ladies I am having a little trouble. I have included a picture to show my problems. I have a sears compound mitre saw that tilts to the left. I measured and re-measured several times. I used a protractor, a 45 drawing triangle and a few others that I am not sure of the names of. Anyway I was positive that I had it set up for a proper 45 degree angle. I made the cuts and low and behold I found that I had mastered the 44 degree cut (I didnt actually measure). I need some advice on making a proper 45 degree cut soI dont have this hideous gap at my corners. Suggestions?

Hey Griz,
You are experiencing a common problem. There are several approaches that may help. If the piece is not too tall, make the cut with the piece standing up rather than laying down. That way is much easier to prevent the piece from creeping as the cut is being made.

If that won't work, make sure the piece is laying down with the inside surface down, and hold down HARD on the piece while making the cut. Go easy on the pressure you use while making the cut. That will eliminate tearout on the outside.

Use a 60 or 80 tooth finish blade that is sharp and clean

Periodically, I make test cuts to assure exact angles in case something has gotten out of adjustment.

Some of my thoughts...hope they help

Jerry

[dcalvin4]

Well fellas and ladies I am having a little trouble. I have included a picture to show my problems. I have a sears compound mitre saw that tilts to the left. I measured and re-measured several times. I used a protractor, a 45 drawing triangle and a few others that I am not sure of the names of. Anyway I was positive that I had it set up for a proper 45 degree angle. I made the cuts and low and behold I found that I had mastered the 44 degree cut (I didnt actually measure). I need some advice on making a proper 45 degree cut soI dont have this hideous gap at my corners. Suggestions?

this photo looks like the board has a cup [width] and the reason for the cup is when removing a lot of material on the face side [ c wright carvings] or finishing [seal] your project on one side and leaving the other side to draw moisture even over night can cause this..and all the advise mentioned below is excellant to.. when i made this box i played he$% with joints and finally i cut on a 45 then used a sanding disk on a table saw, and it came out nice just my thoughts denny

[Griz64]

Thanks for the input gang, I really appreciate it. You guys have given me a few things to look at and try. In the next few days I will be trying these things and hopefully I will be able to get a better cut and fit.

[DocWheeler]

Griz,

I have spent too much time preparing and making a box for my wife. Like you, I found the corners a challenge with my cheap table saw. So, I spent the money and bought a 12" disk sander to "finish" the corners after getting them close with the table saw. Worked very well I might add.

Now if I my new strap-clamp had not failed at the critical time, the top hadn't gone into the twist that it did, and I hadn't drilled too much out for the quadrant hinge on one side, it would have been great overall! Still trying to get it finished - spray-can says the temperature should be between 70 and 80 degrees, maybe I'll have to wait a few months!:(

[Old Salt]

one of the most common things that hapen to 45s is that the sides are not the same size . just a small fration of an inch can make a lot of differance. sometimes you can use that to adjust corners. by triming the l
length of the sides or ends.

[drwatkins]

Griz, those "radial arm / Miter / chop saws" are not made for precise work. Take a hold on your saw head and give it a little shake and you will see what i mean. They are made for framing use where accuracy is not as critical. I suggest a good quality miter box and miter or hand saw for accurate cuts. second option would be use the table saw with good blade with 70 teeth (40 tooth minimum) verify the angle of blade and use fence if piece is short enough or invest in a quality miter jig for the table saw about 125 dollars.

[Griz64]

I have a Delta cabinetmakers table saw with all the bells and whistles including the biesmeyer (sp) fence and incra mitre gauge. I guess I will need to use that instead of my mitre saw. The problem is I have way to much crap in my shop and my table saw is also my work bench and the complete center of everything including my new Carvewright workstand. The machine is about a 100 pounds and I dont feel like throwing it around everytime I need to make a cut BUT...it looks like I am going to have to if I expect the quality I am used to. Either that or complete refurb of the garage (shop) when Spring returns...sigh

[Chief]

Dan,

Not quite true. Festool makes a sliding miter saw that is accurate but you pay a price for the acccuracy. The Kapex is $1300. If you truly have the need, investigate this saw.

Chief

[Grampy122]

I have used the miter trimmer for finish cutting 45's and it gives you a clean cut with no tearout.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=6533&filter=mitre

Second choice is to use a router table with a 45 degree bit and use a backup board to reduce tearout.

[Eagle Hollow]

I have used a miter saw for years with near perfect results. The only time I use the cabinet saw is when the cut is too big to be accomplished with the miter saw. I'm trying to imagine not having a miter saw when doing crown molding...or trimming furniture pieces...or building jewelry boxes. Has sure worked well for me the last 35 years or so. Just let the saw do its job. Go easy. If you force the cuts, you get unsatisfactory results.

Jerry

[lawrence]

One thing that I'll add is that you are NOT trying to get two 45 degree angle cuts... what you are trying to accomplish is a 90 angle from 2 pieces....it sounds like semantics, but if you use a table saw and jig for "picture frame" type cuts (not like yours) a sled like this will get you 90 degree angles all day long even if one is 45.2 and one is 44.8 degrees if you cut one side on the left and one on the right
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u313/ldr_klr/DSCF0076Medium-1.jpg

Unfortunately, a jig like this will cause difficulties due to the length of the cut-- for these types of cuts I rely on my 45 degree sled with a VERY carefully angled blade (and clamps!)... for these angles I rely on my tilt box (like a wixey) as I don't trust my miter gauge for these cuts.

Lawrence

[will george]

For what it is worth I thought the same thing from the picture shown. If you look closely at the picture I 'think' I see a radius cut caused by 'curl'. Pictures can be misleading so I am not sure. I think you 'hit the nail on the head' with your observation.

I use a slider chop saw ALOT for crown and other moldings. I have used very good chop saws (Expensive makes them good?) and junk. All seem to do OK on a common 45. With or without a bevel cut.

Over the years I have made hundreds of small boxes so I know from experience that the smaller size make things harder to get perfect/square/mitered cuts.

Just a thought for a old woodworker:

1) Apply adhesive back sandpaper to the bed and fence of your chop saw to help hold the 'stick in process' where it should stay.

2) Check your work (All surfaces) with a common square BEFORE cutting anything!

3) I use a shop made screw-down clamp to hold/flatten 'sticks' that were made flat but have changed before I could cut them. YES... wood warps... and the clamp-down may crack the wood when trying to get it flat. Especially on deepley carved objects.

Just Me!...

[will george]

Lawrence

Love your sled.. I have several (Now.. where to keep them out of the way!)

Your saw a Ridgid? Sort of looks like it. I have one of the first ones. Some say my TS is JUNK but I disagree! It works and works.. Sure wish that motor was inside the cabinet though.

Just a thought.. I use the Wixey and they are GREAT. But.. I think some garage opener or Cell-Phone keeps turning on the one on my router tables! I turn it off.. Next day it is ON?

Such is/are? the hardships of a woodworker...

[Metalhead781]

About 5 years ago I invested $900 in a high end Hitachi 12" dual slide saw. It has the digital readout for both bevel and miter. Only time i had issues with my 45's i was cutting picture frames and the joints weren't right. Went back to the saw and sure enough 45.50 degrees. You can have the best tool in the world but if u don't pay attention it can be useless. As far as crapsman tools (yes i spelled it right). They've been junk for years in my opinion. Black and Decker can make a better drill that's for sure. Their miter saws aren't that bad just toss out the blade that comes with them. Even the Lowe's brand cobalt blades are better.

Just my two cents
MH