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View Full Version : Problems with corner posts and scale pressure



Gary Koval
11-03-2009, 02:10 PM
Just received my unit back from Sears for a broken Z-truck. Couldn't wind the head up or down and found that our friends, at UPS must have shook it up pretty good. Anyway, I got the head lined up using a 2' level, and now when winding up I have a lot of drag, to the point that I'm afraid I will break the tierod assembly. Cranking it down is relatively easy, however, it clicks about every third revolution of the crank. I cannot get any more than 52lbs of pressure on the scale. I have added and subtracted the washers on the clutch crank handle from none to 4 and I am in the range of 32-52lbs of scale pressure during the adding and subtracting of washers. I should add that I have lubed all posts, leadscrews, and tierod assembly with white lith. When I losened the 4 posts I noticed something perhaps out of place (see Pic1). I believe that the washer that is on the post, and is the exact size as the clutch handle washers, should be eliminated and the flat washer on the bolt should be on the top of the post between it and the lateral stabilizer casting assembly. Pic 2 shows the order in which I removed the bolts from each verticle guide rod.
Pic 3 shows how hard the machine must have been dropped to bend up that section of the plastic.
So before I send this back to Sears any ideas, on the low scale pressure and the order of washers? Perhaps the "All Knowing Al Who" could lend some expertise!

DocWheeler
11-03-2009, 02:29 PM
Gary,

With the clearance needed for the newer Z-motor fins LHR is putting washers in various places to get the cover high enough. The washer on top of the post is normal for that activity.

The dropping of the machine hard enough to cause that damage did not help the four column alignment and is probably the cause of your problem in my opinion.

Gary Koval
11-03-2009, 03:35 PM
But the washers that were on top of the posts and underneath the top were so big and skinny like shims more than washers really. I quess the question I have and could not find elsewere in the forum was are the smaller, thicker washers the ones that should be on top of the post and below the top? The thinner ones look like they might have put there by the techs at Sears. I don't remember that fine a washer being in between there originally. I tried both washers and could not see a difference in the clutch cranking down.

DocWheeler
11-03-2009, 03:37 PM
Gary,

Mine just has the thick washer under the bolt-heads.

PCW
11-03-2009, 03:45 PM
Gary,

It goes back together just like your first picture. My has them on all four posts like in your picture. If you are not looking for the shims when you remove the side covers they normally fall out and are lost.




But the washers that were on top of the posts and underneath the top were so big and skinny like shims more than washers really. I quess the question I have and could not find elsewere in the forum was are the smaller, thicker washers the ones that should be on top of the post and below the top? The thinner ones look like they might have put there by the techs at Sears. I don't remember that fine a washer being in between there originally. I tried both washers and could not see a difference in the clutch cranking down.

Gary Koval
11-03-2009, 05:52 PM
Just didn't seem right to me. I'll let it go the way it is. Here I come Sears!
Gary

Digitalwoodshop
11-03-2009, 08:40 PM
WOW.... Looks like a attempt to level the head to prevent binding....

I took the sander to my cover to remove the excess plastic after installing the new Z bundle. The washers would have been good....

I am wondering if shipping damage caused the first problem, a tweaked frame.... Bent....

For pressure problems I would try loosening all 4 smooth vertical rods and turning them 1/4 turn to remove any marks in the smooth from binding....

AL

Ike
11-03-2009, 09:14 PM
WOW.... Looks like a attempt to level the head to prevent binding....

I took the sander to my cover to remove the excess plastic after installing the new Z bundle. The washers would have been good....

I am wondering if shipping damage caused the first problem, a tweaked frame.... Bent....

For pressure problems I would try loosening all 4 smooth vertical rods and turning them 1/4 turn to remove any marks in the smooth from binding....

AL

You know guys I was pretending this does not happen I am waiting for my CC that is refurbished and being UPS ........Oh I hope it doesn't come all busted up.

Ike

dbfletcher
11-03-2009, 09:37 PM
You know guys I was pretending this does not happen I am waiting for my CC that is refurbished and being UPS ........Oh I hope it doesn't come all busted up.

Ike

I really just dont get all this "shippers" bashing. I've ordered 1000's of fairly sensative computer equipment packages over the years..... and I have only had 1 package that was visible damaged and one that actually was destroyed.

If the shipping company where even 1/10 as reckless as this forum makes them out.. i cant imagine any of them being in business anymore (UPS, Fedex, or USPS). I'm sure there are probably public stats out there for the rate of damage to packages... but I would have to think it is most likely less than 1 in 10000. The server I order are generally in the 75 to 125 lbs range so it is similar to the carvewright.

As someone said in another post.. if there is a lot of damage fom shipping, LHR need to revise there packing methods.

Doug Fletcher

dbfletcher
11-03-2009, 09:46 PM
Well I for one have had to shell out a large amount of money because the "shipper" broke the post and tie rods and even though it was insured through them the "shipper" they denied the claim.

If you have read any of these post I guess there is 2 in 1000? Well in this thread there is...............

Ike

Thanks Ike... I guess I've been lucky then. I didnt have any issue with UPS fully refunding the insurred value on either the destroyed package.. or the damaged one. I was suprised at how smooth and easy it was. Filed the claim... 4 days later had the check in hand. (both were via UPS btw)

Doug Fletcher

Ike
11-03-2009, 09:50 PM
Thanks Ike... I guess I've been lucky then. I didnt have any issue with UPS fully refunding the insurred value on either the destroyed package.. or the damaged one. I was suprised at how smooth and easy it was. Filed the claim... 4 days later had the check in hand. (both were via UPS btw)

Doug Fletcher

I removed the post because this is non productive....

Ike

dbfletcher
11-03-2009, 09:55 PM
I removed the post because this is non productive....

Ike

Ok.. i agree it was a topic drift, but I'm not sure i agree about "non productive". If there really are a lot of machines being damaged via shipment... it is good for consumers to know as well as LHR. In the 6 machines that have passed through my hands.... there hasnt been any visible damage nor any obviously poblems caused by shipping. But for thoses who have had problems.. please start a new thread so we can get a feel for how many ppl had issues.

Thanks,

Doug Fletcher

hess
11-03-2009, 10:31 PM
You know guys I was pretending this does not happen I am waiting for my CC that is refurbished and being UPS ........Oh I hope it doesn't come all busted up.

Ike

Hey Ike the UPS guy came flying past here just a few min ago with a CC hanging off the back was it yours. lol

So you got a busted bottom too I just now get it

Still think a CC CW junk yard would make money

Heck I got an old Shop smith and I see guy rippin em apart to sell on Ebay worth more by the part

c6craig
11-03-2009, 11:17 PM
I really just dont get all this "shippers" bashing. I've ordered 1000's of fairly sensative computer equipment packages over the years..... and I have only had 1 package that was visible damaged and one that actually was destroyed.

If the shipping company where even 1/10 as reckless as this forum makes them out.. i cant imagine any of them being in business anymore (UPS, Fedex, or USPS). I'm sure there are probably public stats out there for the rate of damage to packages... but I would have to think it is most likely less than 1 in 10000. The server I order are generally in the 75 to 125 lbs range so it is similar to the carvewright.

As someone said in another post.. if there is a lot of damage fom shipping, LHR need to revise there packing methods.

Doug Fletcher

Honestly Doug, I don't think that's a very fair comparison. I also deal with UPS and Fedex ordering hundreds of thousands (sometimes well in to the millions) of dollars of sensitive network and server equipment and have had rare issues.

But these machines are balanced. Posts get knocked out of whack, heads end up not level. A server gets smacked around you may have to reseat a card or some memory. Not quite the same amount of work involved and far easier to troubleshoot.

All due respect,
Craig

dbfletcher
11-03-2009, 11:39 PM
Honestly Doug, I don't think that's a very fair comparison. I also deal with UPS and Fedex ordering hundreds of thousands (sometimes well in to the millions) of dollars of sensitive network and server equipment and have had rare issues.

But these machines are balanced. Posts get knocked out of whack, heads end up not level. A server gets smacked around you may have to reseat a card or some memory. Not quite the same amount of work involved and far easier to troubleshoot.

All due respect,
Craig

Craig,

Im not really disagreeing.. but my servers typically ship triple boxed too.... that was my real point. If machines are getting to thier desination in any condition than the original, LHR may need to revise ther packing and shipping methods. Sure.. there will be the occasional dropped/banged package... but proper packing and material should reduce that to an acceptable range. I wont tie up this thread anymore though. If there is a problem... it needs to be addressed.

And I remember in the early days (late 80's early 90s) memory or cards came loose all the time... but I cant tell you that last time I had to reseat anything for the computer or equipment purchases I have made.

Doug Fletcher

Gary Koval
11-04-2009, 10:49 AM
Hey Al,
I did do as you said turning the posts, to no avail. What I did notice is that the bottom panel held with the 12 screws, does not line up at all with the bottom as it had before it went out, not even close, binding in opposite corners, bad.
Fellas, Ladies,
I have had two CC,s damaged between my house and LHR and Sears. I'm not saying its the shipper nor the company it was going to, I just don't know. What I do know is that when it came back, they had to be sent back because I could not make them function properly, and in both case it was the head not being able to go up/down the way it should. I have in the past blamed UPS because I assumed the Company involved, would not send out a non-functioning unit, but I could be wrong. I want to add that in both cases also, the box received back was in worse shape than when it left, much worse.
Gary
P.S. Its on its way back down to Garland, TX

seabass
11-04-2009, 10:55 AM
I don't get that. The way my CW(refurb) were delivered they are packed in a way where the head can not move and if it did the Styrofoam would have to be broken and practically destryed before the head would move.

Wasn't your unit packed within the Styrofoam? Possibly the refurbished units are packed better becasue they are not in original box?

Ike
11-04-2009, 06:49 PM
Seabass even in the original box if you drop it or ir falls off another box there will be damage. I have a story for you I ordered a computer for my folks and I recieved a call from a person who lived up the road about 5 miles from my parents. She got my number from a box that fell out of this little brown delivery truck! She said she found it on her private road where she and others live and 100 feet up the road was another box that also had name and number and both had Dell on the boxes!

Then she told me she told the driver and he picked up both boxes and left. Then about 10 minutes after she called guess who drove up trying to deliver my folks computer and monitor? I asked for his name and he asked why? I then let him know I received a phone call from a neighbor and boy did his face turn red!

To think he was going to deliver the 2 boxes as if nothing happened! Needless to say I refused the boxes contacted Dell and the delivery company. Dell was not happy and of course the little brown truck company acted surprised!

I also have had a CC damaged during shipping, but that is another story! ;)

Ike

seabass
11-04-2009, 06:50 PM
I am saying the issue he had the way mine was packaged the head moving is impossible. Its not a computer and he said the head was wound up to the top, an impossibility the way my CC was packaged, that's all I am saying. His issue of the head moving just could not happen unless they took the Styrofoam out from between the head and base the Styrofoam broke in half and moved.

I have no idea how a new item is packaged but my rerfurb the head was totally not able to be moved unless I pried off the foam. The box would have to be torn open and the Styrofoam half out of the box for this to happen.

Ike
11-04-2009, 06:52 PM
Ok not going to argue with you! Are you willing to pack your machine just as well as you said it was packed and drop it?

Ike

seabass
11-04-2009, 06:55 PM
I am not arguing at all, just saying the head could not move the way MY CW was packaged. He should have rejected the shipment and send it back day one if he really thought it was a shipping issue, I would have.

Ike
11-04-2009, 07:01 PM
Oh ok were not say the head moved it broke the base and tie rod assembly. And will knock the head out of alignment if the post is not broke! A lot of times you can't tell from the outside it has been dropped or damaged until you open the box and see the broken styrofoam. Plus if they are like my driver he will just drop it off at the door and leave. If we are home or not. Like this morning I got up late and was surprised to see my CC on my porch without me signing for it. So if the box was visibly damaged the driver could just say it was fine when he delivered it.

Ike

seabass
11-04-2009, 07:09 PM
On one of my CW the head pressure was perfect out of the box.

Then about 25 hours later the head pressure is 55.

Anything I did? Is this normal? Should I adjust right away?

I noticed one washer is not even present on two of the posts.

Oh the posts are lubed up properly and other maintenance etc always done.

Ike
11-04-2009, 07:52 PM
On one of my CW the head pressure was perfect out of the box.

Then about 25 hours later the head pressure is 55.

Anything I did? Is this normal? Should I adjust right away?

I noticed one washer is not even present on two of the posts.

Oh the posts are lubed up properly and other maintenance etc always done.


Sorry for the delays I have my baby girl here, my grand daughter and she wants attention!
I am not sure it could be saw dust this is such a compact unit any dust can affect the pressure. I am having too much pressure with my CW. Today it acts up when I get my other CC!

I would check the gears and tie rod at the bottom and see if there is enough grease. Hmm I never heard of it loosing pressure just from use? Have you over extended the head to the point it locked up?

Like I said mine has stopped clicking so I have too much pressure so I need Al's help! Guess I need to start a thread about my issue.

By the way no offense intended with the shippers issue! Just talking that is what so great about this forum we can talk and disagree!

Ike