Would like advice from sign makers

[Griz64]

Hey guys, I was just wondering what you guys charge for your services? I am brand new to this but can see the potential of making money with it. I am just wanting to get some round figures right now because I have a looooooong way to go before I can charge people good money for this. If you would be willing to help me out with that I would greatly appreciate it.

[Icutone2]

Hello, I charge $ 20.00 per hour for the machine time material is extra.
Lee

[Digitalwoodshop]

4 times material...

AL

[Ike]

Hey guys, I was just wondering what you guys charge for your services? I am brand new to this but can see the potential of making money with it. I am just wanting to get some round figures right now because I have a looooooong way to go before I can charge people good money for this. If you would be willing to help me out with that I would greatly appreciate it.

Griz, I do own a sign shop and if it helps I charge by the board foot. For example I have pre cut sign blanks 6", 8", 10", 12" wide 24" long. For residential signs I charge $30.00 to $35.00 a board foot depending on the amount of work. I.E. for a recessed letter with just black spray paint maybe a simple image $30.00. For raised lettering with color paint and or detailed image. $35.00.

This works for all sizes you take the thickness times the width times the length divided by 144. Simple example a 1" thick board 12" wide and 24" long = 2 board feet. 1 X 12 X 12 / 144...12 x 12 = 144 divided (/) by 144 = 1 board foot. Please take no offense if you know how to figure board feet and to everyone else who knows. This is for those who do not and wants to learn how. Another common misunderstanding I get from my customers they confuse the width of a board with the length.

Anyway back to pricing I have in the past had separate charges for finish and for images. That became too confusing for my wife so I went with the set price. I do still charge more for a detailed or special pattern.

For commercial signs same thing except now the thickness of the board sometimes changes. Say you have a sign order for a 4 foot wide 8 foot long 2 inch thick sign. The formula is 2" x 48" x 72" / 144 = 48 board feet. I charge $50.00 to $ 65.00 a board foot for commercial. Plus with 2" stock you see it doubles the board foot. I often drop the 2" to 1", why? Let's say it is a pretty easy sign with the above measurements. I would charge $50.00 a foot. That would be $2400.00 that would be great if you can get that, but I only know of well established sign shop getting that price! So I would charge $1200.00.

Now you are thinking I can't make that big of sign with the CW! Yes you can!! You design it in parts and it takes some calculation, but it can be done! Another commercial size sign I offer for Ranches, boardwalk type signs are 12" to 14" wide by 48" long so a 12" by 48" is 4 board feet 1" x 12" x 48" / 144 = 4 board feet. Again $45.00 to $65.00 and anything between! For a ranch sign I charge $180.00 to $250.00.

Ok now I have made this look far too much trouble it really is not! You buy your lumber either by the board foot or linear foot. With linear they charge the price times the length of the board. Board and linear is the same cost with 12" stock. Another thing to keep in mind even though the board you buy is 11 1/2" wide and 5.5" for 6" etc. you are paying for the true size. So pass it on to the customer! Remember a 6" x 8 foot board may cost say $20.00 for example, you can get 4 signs out of it and if the signs are $30.00 each you made $120.00 just off the board and finish and paint is minimal not even $3.00 and $5.00 for the board. Material cost $ 8.00 per sign for a profit of $22.00 per sign times $88.00 for a $32.00 investment! (less your time)

Charging by how long the CW takes to make the sign is a double edge sword in my opinion. Say the sign 6" take 15 minutes to make and you charge $20.00 an hour then 15 min. is $5.00 and say $ 5.00 for the board and paint and finish $5.00 and another $10.00 for time you are at the $30.00. That works out.

I have a cabin sign I charge $85.00 that takes almost 5 hrs. to make by the CW. There is $100.00 there then another $10.00 for the board and with this sign more like $10.00 for finish including my time so I am at $120.00. I tried that price and sold none. The sign is 12" by 24" so 2 board feet and detailed I tried $60.00 a foot also for tying up the machine. I love the sign, but it takes so long to make. So I went to $42.50 more then the $35.00 to cover the extra time.

As I said I have a sign business and hand route and use my CW for special signs. I attend festival, craft fairs etc. and make the signs on the spot. If I just had the CW to use it could not keep up. So I would just offer the signs that took 30 min or less to make and sold them without finish. Or just take orders and charge shipping cost or add it into your price.

I just came back from a very busy event I got not keep up with even by hand or CW! I knew each sign would cost anywhere from $15 to $20.00 to ship. So I offered $10.00 shipping not to lose the business. I was looking for volume to cover the extra cost. As I said if I was just taking orders I would reduce the shipping or add it to the price.

Lol I have wrote a chapter not a post! Feel free to pm me and I will give me you my number and explain anything I didn't explain well!

Ike

[Griz64]

WOW Ike, Thanks for the insight. At this point I really dont have any questions but as I said I have a hell of alot to learn about the machine and its capabilities before I feel comfortable charging people. I did understand it and thank you for the in depth explaination. If its ok with you I will keep you in mind for questions later on down the road. It seems like you have a pretty good working plan that would be worth looking at more closely. Thank you again.

[Ike]

WOW Ike, Thanks for the insight. At this point I really dont have any questions but as I said I have a hell of alot to learn about the machine and its capabilities before I feel comfortable charging people. I did understand it and thank you for the in depth explaination. If its ok with you I will keep you in mind for questions later on down the road. It seems like you have a pretty good working plan that would be worth looking at more closely. Thank you again.

Griz anytime you need help just ask! I have been doing this for many years!

Ike

[chebytrk]

Griz anytime you need help just ask! I have been doing this for many years!

Ike

Hey Ike,
By chance what would you recommend the price be for the Christmas wreath? It's a very popular item and alot of people are making requests for it. Just wondering if anyone has made any for sale and what are the going prices.

[Fardoche]

It's a very interesting post!

I charge minimum 5 x the cost of wood.

Ike, you provide us with very interesting information!!!

Thanks! :p:p:p:p

Francois
Upnorth Montreal, Québec, Canada!

[WRW]

Hi All
I see that Fardoche and AL have posted 5 times and 4 times as a charge. My question would be is that simply material cost or is that your selling cost of completed project?

Ike, great post, lots of information for us new people to digest. Thanks for sharing.

I believe its worth saying again, What a forum, I believe it represents what a forum should be.

As my knoledge grows I to hope to be able to help others entering here as well. Maybe I can save Al, Ike, Ken and others like them, that are always replying, some typing time.

Have a great day all!
Richard

[Ike]

Hey Ike,
By chance what would you recommend the price be for the Christmas wreath? It's a very popular item and alot of people are making requests for it. Just wondering if anyone has made any for sale and what are the going prices.


Well the same thing, choose a board foot price and figure it by the size of the wreath. I am not sure the size, say it is 24" by 24" that would be 4 board feet.

I have not ever made one so I really don't know the time it takes to complete. I would say I would charge $25.00- $30.00 a board foot trust me that is a cheap shop rate! Now you need to take in account the area you are selling your items. I try to find the retirement and summer home communities, plus high tourist-ism. Try a furniture store or hardware etc.

Then the more you make you can go by volume. I have been to shows I broke even and some I lost money. Then I have done well, you just get out there and find the good ones!

I went to the California State fair with our soda wagon this year and it was BAD! This was a 18 day fair so I was hoping for a good money making event. The problem was location, it means the difference of $1000 of dollars. I had one fair I would make $4000.00 in 5 days and the fair manager quit so the new one moved me down 4 spots and I lost $2000.00. Then she lied to me about the move! That is another story!

Back to the State fair the events before it I made more money! My friend who has the funnel cake stand made more money in one Saturday then I did the whole fair! Again he was in a good area high traffic. So events will put you in an area not so good the first year. But if you know the event can be good the next year ask to be move.

Craftmaster News is a great source for finding craft fairs and other shows. They have a West coast and East coast issues. They will let you know the attendance and the vendors let you know if it is good or bad.

Wow you asked for a price for the wreath and I wrote another chapter! I hope that helped!

Ike

[Ike]

Hi All
I see that Fardoche and AL have posted 5 times and 4 times as a charge. My question would be is that simply material cost or is that your selling cost of completed project?

Ike, great post, lots of information for us new people to digest. Thanks for sharing.

I believe its worth saying again, What a forum, I believe it represents what a forum should be.

As my knoledge grows I to hope to be able to help others entering here as well. Maybe I can save Al, Ike, Ken and others like them, that are always replying, some typing time.

Have a great day all!
Richard

Richard, thank you for the kind words! I don't use the 4 or 5 times the material formula because with signs you sell yourself short. My example of the board cost to make simple say it cost $20.00 for an 8 foot board.

I can make 1 sign 12" by 8 foot long that would be $80.00 or $100.00. Or 2 4 foot signs that would be 4 X $10.00 so that would be $40.00. or $50.00 Or 4 24" signs at $5.00 for $20.00 -$25.00 per sign.

With charging by the board foot the same 12" by 8 foot board the board feet is 8 board foot. At the least amount I charge is $25.00 that is $200.00. 4 foot $100.00 24" $50.00. And with $30.00 - $40.00 well you do the math!

I know I have undersold myself just to get the order and I regretted it after the sale! It took me X amount of hours and by the time I figured my time and the what I sold the sign for I was making $8.00 an hour!

I am not saying my way is the way! It has worked for me, remember you have a product the customer wants and the machine they do not have!

Ike

[Fardoche]

Richard,

for your information, I charge a minimum of 5 times the cost of wood unfinished product.

I don't do any finishing on the product I sell (either with carvewright or as a woodworker)

Hope this can help!


Hi All
I see that Fardoche and AL have posted 5 times and 4 times as a charge. My question would be is that simply material cost or is that your selling cost of completed project?

Ike, great post, lots of information for us new people to digest. Thanks for sharing.

I believe its worth saying again, What a forum, I believe it represents what a forum should be.

As my knoledge grows I to hope to be able to help others entering here as well. Maybe I can save Al, Ike, Ken and others like them, that are always replying, some typing time.

Have a great day all!
Richard

[TIMCOSBY]

qouted a freind of mine $2500 for a 30"x30" sand blasted sign with a company name on it. don't sell yourself short.

[Ike]

Richard by no means am I saying my method is the best or only way! I found with signs with one board you can make 4 signs. Anyway I was only sharing and by no means think anybody elses methods is wrong.

Ike

[Ike]

qouted a freind of mine $2500 for a 30"x30" sand blasted sign with a company name on it. don't sell yourself short.

Lol thanks Tim I have not dare to charge that amount! That is 6.25 board feet at $400.00 a board foot! That proves what I said only the well established sign shops can charge that amount! My uncle has a sign shop and all the best CNC and vinyl letter machines etc. He charges high prices and can after 39 years!

Ike