Clean Y rails

[chebytrk]

When I ran my machine it stopped over 10 times in carving my Eagle clock project. Each time it stated to clean the Y rails and each time I did. This is the first time that it has stopped so many times. Each time I cleaned with Vac and also blew everything out. Is there something else that I should be doing. I was carving in to Poplar wood. I have about 30hrs on the machine. Any suggestions are very welcome. Thanks.

[DocWheeler]

chebytrk,

What version of software and firmware are you running?
Starting in 1.132 (I think), an attempt was made to detect problems by noting the amount energy needed to move the Y truck (again, this is what I think they did), anyway it is causing more grief than help.

I was hoping that they made helpful changes in 1.150 - please tell me that they did!

[chebytrk]

chebytrk,

What version of software and firmware are you running?
Starting in 1.132 (I think), an attempt was made to detect problems by noting the amount energy needed to move the Y truck (again, this is what I think they did), anyway it is causing more grief than help.

I was hoping that they made helpful changes in 1.150 - please tell me that they did!

I've loaded the latest software 1.150. Even reformatted my card and that's now at 1.150 as well. I've also got the latest Ztruck installed based on the information on how to check for it (I purchased my machine in Dec 08). Never had this Y rail issue before. I always make it a point to make sure the machine is clean of sawdust before, during and after each project. Maybe I'm going to have to break down and buy a DC which I was planning to do anyway, just trying to save up a little for it first. I just found it real unusual that it kept stopping and telling me to clean the Y rails so often (or even at all since I never did that before).

[chebytrk]

Started on one of my previous POM (Herb Plant stand) and everything slowly became worse yesterday. Did my first carve of the sides and I received a "Please clean Y Rails and then press enter". I cleaned everything with the VAC and also blew out any extra saw dust. This happend three times. I finished that portion and began the Corner braces and this is where it went downhill fast. Project stopped 28 times during the first 2 corner piece carvings before I gave up and decided to come here today to look for suggestions. I left the machine plugged in just in case I get a remedy for this nightmare. Carving of the 2 corner braces alone took approx 3hrs because of all the stopping and cleaning and starting up again. Only thing I know is that this wasn't happening before I went to SW 1.150. Could it be the SW upload that I did on it? When it asks to clean the Y Rails, I don't see hardly any sawdust built up. I just run the blower vac on it and start it back up again. It does anywhere from 8-17 Sweeps before it stops again with the same thing....... PLEASE CLEAN Y RAILS and PRESS ENTER TO PROCEED. Somebody help please !

[DocWheeler]

chebytrk,

I share your frustration, I have just about lost interest in using the machine at this point - very unhappy!
LHR has known about that bug before 1.150, lets hope that they finally do something about it with the next "update"!

Edit - I keep pressing Ctrl instead of Shift, it makes Clean come out as lean!

[chebytrk]

I'm just surprised that more people are not experiencing this issue. I guess I have to wait until the next update to the Software comes out so I can continue to use my machine. That's crazy! Anyone know when the next software is due to come out? I keep hearing soon, but how soon is soon? Really disappointed now.........

[PCW]

Check the link under my signature for the update information.

[chebytrk]

Check the link under my signature for the update information.

Thanks.......... let's see what happens.....

[Digitalwoodshop]

It could me mechanical... I would remove the Y motor and check the gearbox and clean the cogs in the belt.

Check for a worn bearing in the gear box, big gear.

AL

[Steven Alford]

This is the only time that I have heard of anyone having this problem and is associating it with Version 1.15. I am not having problems with this so I would tend to believe that it is mechanical.

Try cleaning the "no mans land", as Al calls it, between the rollers of the carving head. It is easy to clean the right and left side of the Y rail, but things can get trapped behind the carving head that you can't get to unless you remove and clean behind it.

[chebytrk]

This is the only time that I have heard of anyone having this problem and is associating it with Version 1.15. I am not having problems with this so I would tend to believe that it is mechanical.

Try cleaning the "no mans land", as Al calls it, between the rollers of the carving head. It is easy to clean the right and left side of the Y rail, but things can get trapped behind the carving head that you can't get to unless you remove and clean behind it.

Thanks guys. Is there a pdf that can show me where and how to take this apart to clean out? I just tried it again and it's still shutting off. I do think now that something else must be causing this. Maybe I just need to take this apart and clean it up as much as possible.

[mtylerfl]

I'm just surprised that more people are not experiencing this issue. I guess I have to wait until the next update to the Software comes out so I can continue to use my machine. That's crazy! Anyone know when the next software is due to come out? I keep hearing soon, but how soon is soon? Really disappointed now.........

Hello Jerry,

I have never had a "Clean Y Rails" message on any version, including 1.150. The only version I never personally updated to was 1.134, but have used all the other versions from 1.119 up through the current 1.150.

I must admit I am at a loss as to why you and Doc both seem to have the same problem. Wish I could be of some help. I desperately want you to enjoy your machines and put the troubleshooting behind you very soon.

All the Best...

[Steven Alford]

Thanks guys. Is there a pdf that can show me where and how to take this apart to clean out? I just tried it again and it's still shutting off. I do think now that something else must be causing this. Maybe I just need to take this apart and clean it up as much as possible.

I wish I could help you with this one, but I have never taken mine apart. Al would be the one to ask. Do you know about the troubleshooting pdf's?? If so, go to those and see if what you need is there.

[earlyrider]

Check also for a stuck or tight bearing on the Y truck.
Ron

[WorkedWood]

Well folks I just started experiencing the same problem with one addition that I’ll try to explain here. As the carving progresses past 23% and begins to carve three .25 deep regions I can hear a quick click as if the gears jumped several times, then the error appears. I didn’t notice the clicking until the third try on a project I’ve run 6 times already. What I did notice was that the pattern was off about .25 after cleaning the rails. I’m going to try and remove the head and give it a good cleaning, will report back soon.

[chebytrk]

Well folks I just started experiencing the same problem with one addition that I’ll try to explain here. As the carving progresses past 23% and begins to carve three .25 deep regions I can hear a quick click as if the gears jumped several times, then the error appears. I didn’t notice the clicking until the third try on a project I’ve run 6 times already. What I did notice was that the pattern was off about .25 after cleaning the rails. I’m going to try and remove the head and give it a good cleaning, will report back soon.

My problem appears to have gone away after I took the top completely off and gave everything inside a real good cleaning. However, I also recall hearing the "clicking" sound you mention right before my machine would stop and give me the "clean y rails" error message. After I cleaned everything real good I ran another small project and everything worked fine. I'll try and run another project this week as I've been pretty busy lately. I'll make another post when I do.

[DocWheeler]

Jerry,

If you heard clicking when the Y truck was being moved by the Y motor there is a good possibility that the machine screw on top of the Y-belt idler/tension bracket is not tight.

[WorkedWood]

As best as I could detect the sound it appeared to be coming from that side of the machine. I plan on breaking it down tonight and trying again. That deeper region of the carve must put a lot more pressure on the Y axis than the rest because it has repeated the error and stopped the machine in the exact same spot on 4 occasions. I thought the pattern may have gotten a glitch at first. I may not write much in the forum, but I do use the wisdom supplied here. Thanks!

[chebytrk]

Jerry,

If you heard clicking when the Y truck was being moved by the Y motor there is a good possibility that the machine screw on top of the Y-belt idler/tension bracket is not tight.

Ken, is there a pic of the area that you're talking about? I did find a screw adjustment on the right side (facing the y rails). However that screw adjustment head was pointing toward the metal side cover and I couldn't get to it. I was able to get my fingers in there, but that's about it. Once I cleaned everything the next project ran smooth and I've heard no more clicking or gotten any error messages. I'd still like to know exactly where that machine screw is located so I can check it. Sorry, I know probably Ronnie Milsap could find it with no problem, but me......... that's another story! :D

[DocWheeler]

Jerry,

The screw on the back side of the machine, that is pointing toward the Y belt, is the tensioning screw (or bolt). It is compressing a spring and pulling tension on the belt.
The screw that I am talking about is on the top of the metal bracket that the tensioning screw pulls on and is above a cardboard cover if I remember right.
This screw holds the idler in the position that the tensioning spring has it when "relaxed". If it is loose, the motor can pull the idler enough to get enough slack in the belt that it will jump cogs in the belt (the clicking sound)!

I'm at work right now, but it should show in the exploded view of the machine.

[chebytrk]

Jerry,

The screw on the back side of the machine, that is pointing toward the Y belt, is the tensioning screw (or bolt). It is compressing a spring and pulling tension on the belt.
The screw that I am talking about is on the top of the metal bracket that the tensioning screw pulls on and is above a cardboard cover if I remember right.
This screw holds the idler in the position that the tensioning spring has it when "relaxed". If it is loose, the motor can pull the idler enough to get enough slack in the belt that it will jump cogs in the belt (the clicking sound)!

I'm at work right now, but it should show in the exploded view of the machine.

Thank you sir! I'm at work too, but I'm lucky enough to work from home ; ) Thanks again.

[Kenm810]

Part #59 Compression Spring - Y Belt Tension MWM P1232 Page 4
Part #60 Screw, Cap Head, Shoulder, M5x.8 x6 Long, 6mm shoulder, 20 mm long SCMR-5.0-0.80CB-03AB-0620 Page 4

[WorkedWood]

Okay, I took off the cover gave her a good wiping and lube tightened the compression bracket and re-assembled…. Started the same project and once it hit the deeper carved area stalled out (but didn’t click or skip) so part of the problem is solved. It stalled out three or four times as it opened the region wider, once it made two passes it was off to the races again until it hit another deep region (wash, rinse, lather, and yes repeat). It appears to me that the tolerance for the Y-axis error is a bit too sensitive. I admit the motor bogged down a little when I was using 1.32 but it never gave me a concern. Having it stop each time it hits a harder/deeper cut will get very frustrating. I need to make about 10 of these projects for gifts and at this rate it will take me till December to get them all cut.

Thanks for the advise everyone, I’m contemplating going back to 1.32.

[ruggybear]

I had many "Clean Y rails" errors. I was also haveing other problems as well so I boxed the unit up and sent it off to LHR for a rebuild. The unit is three years old and has many hours of carve time.

LHR completely went over the machine and returned it within three weeks. Not bad as I just sent it to them without them saying OK.

They repaired the 'cut motor', the 'Y motor', and replaced the power supply.

The "Clean Y rails" errors were less but still happening when getting into deeper carve areas. I was very frustrated and even though the 1/16 carve bit felt sharp I installed a NEW 1/16 carving bit.

PROBLEM SOLVED. I even went back to the old bit for one last test and sure enough the "Clean Y rails" error returned. That bit is now history.

[mtylerfl]

Wow! Nice catch - that probably would have been the last thing I would have thought of as the cause for Y errors. Does make sense, though - a dull bit would have to work harder to plow through the wood and cause more resistance for the truck.

[ruggybear]

Here is a picture of one of the carves giving me the clean Y rails error with the used 1/16" carve bit. The stock is .750 Red Oak and the carving depth was around .470.

As mentioned in my previous post the new bit solved the problem.

Cannot post the mpc because it is a purchased pattern.

[WorkedWood]

I have two new bits on order. I thought of that since my bit is several months old and I wasn't experiencing the error with any other bits, but I discounted it thinking how could a bit cause this. I’ll confirm the same once the new bits arrive (Tues-Wed) of next week.

[Steven Alford]

I have asked this question before but with not answers.
How long on average should a bit last? 50 hours, 60 hours? And lets say you are carving red oak. I know it makes a difference on the wood type.

My bits (CW bits) seem to last about 55 to 60 hours on red oak. I am trying some new ones from Soigeneris (sp) so I am hoping to get longer life out of those.

[cnsranch]

Steven -

Do a search - "bit life".

DWS had 1500 hours on his before retiring them.

[WorkedWood]

well folks the new bits did the trick. I wouldn't have thought a bit with less than 50 hours could have caused an error like that, but lesson learned.

[Steven Alford]

Steven -

Do a search - "bit life".

DWS had 1500 hours on his before retiring them.

1500 hours????????
What was he carving? Butter!!