Premium 3D artwork too expensive for you?

[Thomas James]

I am not sure I understand those who say Gantry Graphics http://www.gantryco.com are too expensive. Maybe they are talking about long term resell profit. If you are going to only make one product for a customer, then yes, it can be costly. But that is not the market for these graphics.

Having someone make a custom one of this type of quality is going to cost you $400 to $1000 or more unless the artist gives you a break when you allow them to resell the finished product which Gantry does with their custom work. I personally know that these graphics can take as long to make as hand carving it yourself... if you know how.

I for one, use Gantry Graphics because of the high-end products we make and the fact they we sell multiple units with the same engravings. Once you buy them they are yours to use over and over. I make my money back on the first sale.

My suggestion is to get away from low end products and come up with something unique and one of a kind that commands a good price in a good niche.


If someone here knows how to make these premium graphics for less, please add your work in this thread for all to see. What I am seeing as comparable across the forums is not even close.

The Gantry Partner Program costs $225 and comes with any graphic on the site. Then each additional one is only $39.00

Therefore, you could get the whole Patriotic set for about $800; which is the cost of one custom job in many cases.

Here is an example of the US Seal on a humidor we built:

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/humidor-size-comparison.jpg

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/military-humidor-6.jpg

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/military-humidor-1.jpg

Thomas James
http://www.premiumboxes.com

[atauer]

Thomas,

Keep in mind that the machine is for hobbyist use and most of the people on here do not use it for profit. They use it to create things for themselves and maybe a few family members.

Also, yes the images are amazing and are fairly high priced. I myself would not pay that much for one of the images. I would rather try to find something that would be cheaper in my pocket...

True, most of the patterns you are coming across are not of the best quality. But then again, most of the patterns that you find on here are made by people who DO NOT own software that can cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars for the package, as many cannot afford software packages like that. I myself am included in that group.

Most of the users here could care less what the patterns look like or how much they cost. They are here mainly for the enjoyment of the Carvewright.

This statement is not put out there to bash you or the company you are promoting in your post, but the price for those are way too high, IMHO.

[FINGERS]

Very well put Atauer.

[cnsranch]

Check out this guy's website - I think we need to start doing Certificates of Authenticity also......except for you, Alex:mrgreen:

[RobertP]

This goes to show that you get what you pay for.

What machine did you carve the pattern with that is below the drawer pull? very detailed.

[Ike]

I am not sure I understand those who say Gantry Graphics http://www.gantryco.com are too expensive. Maybe they are talking about long term resell profit. If you are going to only make one product for a customer, then yes, it can be costly. But that is not the market for these graphics.

Having someone make a custom one of this type of quality is going to cost you $400 to $1000 or more unless the artist gives you a break when you allow them to resell the finished product which Gantry does with their custom work. I personally know that these graphics can take as long to make as hand carving it yourself... if you know how.

I for one, use Gantry Graphics because of the high-end products we make and the fact they we sell multiple units with the same engravings. Once you buy them they are yours to use over and over. I make my money back on the first sale.

My suggestion is to get away from low end products and come up with something unique and one of a kind that commands a good price in a good niche.


If someone here knows how to make these premium graphics for less, please add your work in this thread for all to see. What I am seeing as comparable across the forums is not even close.

The Gantry Partner Program costs $225 and comes with any graphic on the site. Then each additional one is only $39.00

Therefore, you could get the whole Patriotic set for about $800; which is the cost of one custom job in many cases.

Here is an example of the US Seal on a humidor we built:

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/humidor-size-comparison.jpg

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/military-humidor-6.jpg

http://www.premiumboxes.com/storage/military-humidor-1.jpg

Thomas James
http://www.premiumboxes.com

Thomas, I don't think anybody thinks the patterns are not worth it, but the CW is a hobbyist machine. Matter of fact LHR even states the machine is not for commercial use.

I have a sign shop and have bought patterns that customers requested and I charge them what it cost me. For some common patterns I have reused them several times, but for the special request patterns I only used them the one time.

I have purchased several patterns from Vector Art 3D and the collections are the best way to go! But for me as a sign maker I want to save money for my customer, so I look for the least expensive pattern price. Of course knowing this site now I will also give my customer the option to choose. I admit the patterns from Gantry are AWESOME!

Ike

PS well I guess I should have scrolled down the page I just repeated Alex! Oh great minds think alike!! Echooooo Echoooo

[Thomas James]

Thomas, I don't think anybody thinks the patterns are not worth it, but the CW is a hobbyist machine. Matter of fact LHR even states the machine is not for commercial use.

I have a sign shop and have bought patterns that customers requested and I charge them what it cost me. For some common patterns I have reused them several times, but for the special request patterns I only used them the one time.

I have purchased several patterns from Vector Art 3D and the collections are the best way to go! But for me as a sign maker I want to save money for my customer, so I look for the least expensive pattern price. Of course knowing this site now I will also give my customer the option to choose. I admit the patterns from Gantry are AWESOME!

Ike

PS well I guess I should have scrolled down the page I just repeated Alex! Oh great minds think alike!! Echooooo Echoooo


Ike & atauer,

You make good points about the CW machine being for hobbyists. This point is well taken and I thank you for your responses. I guess I am one that always wants to turn a "hobby" into something more since it is what I enjoy.

[TWOATLOW8]

Guys....

"If someone here knows how to make these premium graphics for less, please add your work in this thread for all to see. What I am seeing as comparable across the forums is not even close."

Now heres a chance to bring out the best in design..I know theres alot of people out there with $$ programs and some out there just using the designer...

LETS SEE EM...now im not saying post the PTN unless you want too.

Lets see how long it takes to make a good pattern...??

[TWOATLOW8]

Pig art....

I got over 10 hrs of design time...ya it may not look the best but its a start..

[eromran]

Guys....

"If someone here knows how to make these premium graphics for less, please add your work in this thread for all to see. What I am seeing as comparable across the forums is not even close."

Now heres a chance to bring out the best in design..I know theres alot of people out there with $$ programs and some out there just using the designer...

LETS SEE EM...now im not saying post the PTN unless you want too.

Lets see how long it takes to make a good pattern...??Hey i think the graphics do look great but...and i my be wrong but he still has not said what machine carved the seal in the picture he shows so if it was not carved on a carvewright then is that good of graphic going to do any good if the carvewright cant achieve that detail.Would be nice to know if it was carved on carvewright. I'm no expert but you could weigh it up against the probe if you were going to spend that much you know what the probe scans the machine can cut and you could have 100 or 1000 of patterns you could use for yourself. Also virtually none of you time. No software to learn or very little.Now these are definitely not best design but no time and cheap.

[pkunk]

Who's going to try their free test graphic on the CW? :)

[supershingler]

i guess im the one that opened up this can of worms

i just found this sight and it had some amazing stuff on it

i was just looking to see if these pattern would work in my cw. i did not intend it to start an argument on who's is better. i believe we are all looking for a pattern making source. they might seem a bit pricey but if i had to make one up like that i would have a month into it. i love the stuff in the pattern store and when i do custom work i usually show my customers the pattern in there first but you always have someone that is willing to fork out big bucks just to have something better than their neighbor.

if you can buy a pattern that will ultimately sell several items then it is a good investment. if it is a onetime thing then let you customer foot the bill.

i have bought some more expensive pattern and had my customer pay half if i thought i could use it elseware and recoup some of the expense back.

i mostly posted this link to help people that need that one of a kind high quality pattern with a customer that is willing to pay for it.

if they want someone to try one to see if it will work on the cw i would be glad to work with them

happy carving all it shouldnt be long before everyones shop are above 60 so let the sawdust and chip fly

kendall

[Pratyeka]

Just a thought, not a criticism;
I think most people here want to make "simple" objects that they and their loved ones will enjoy using and look at, rather than make intricate "professional" stuff only rich people can afford and who don't even glance at them twice...

I for one prefer the simple things, much more relaxing.

[TWOATLOW8]

i recieved the sample....it looks like it will carve well...but dont wan to waste time or the wood with the lines going thru it.

[RobertP]

How long does it say that it will take to carve it?

[TWOATLOW8]

just brought it in designer and stopped there

[Ike]

Ike & atauer,

You make good points about the CW machine being for hobbyists. This point is well taken and I thank you for your responses. I guess I am one that always wants to turn a "hobby" into something more since it is what I enjoy.
Thomas, again I think the Gantry patterns are AWESOME! I also have a K2 CNC and want to try one of the patterns. Again I thank Kendall for sharing the site and take all the comments with a grain of salt. I mention the patterns are too much for me, yes it is just to buy at this time. But it is a great source to have when great patterns are needed. Lol shoot I look at patterns in the CW pattern store and say they want what for that pattern! The difference is the Gantry patterns I say Wow but I can't afford them, verse I not paying that for that pattern!

I know that all the patterns are hand drawn and it takes pricey software to design the drawings into a pattern. I know the simple Corel patterns I have shared has taken me some time to make.

I know now seeing the site I will be offering the patterns as a choice!

Ike

[fwharris]

Thomas,

I was one of the guys who said that I thought they were too expensive for me as a hobbyist and a wannabee seller of fine carvings. I believe i also agreed that they were great designs. From what I can tell from the images they have fantastic details and I did see several that I know I would enjoy having. I even book marked their site for future reference. Hey, like you stated, this "hobby" might turn into something more! Just judging from your pictures, it shows that you truly have a passion for your hobby.

I did just a quickie look at their package pricing info when I checked the link and did find it more reasonable price wise than a single pattern. If one did have a customer that wanted a specific pattern from them then it might be a good deal in the long run if you knew you could lead more customers in that direction as well.

Well, to end the long short story, I meant no ill comments and probably should have said it in a little better way.

[earlyrider]

I would love to try one of their patterns to see how it would carve on my machine. If I can get one to carve as well as on that humidore, I'd consider seriously the purchase of the package. Need to start the envelope savings method AKA Dave Ramsay. Too much neat stuff, not enough filthy lukor/luker/liquor/money/whatever!;)

[Ike]

I have been reading the format info on the site. I am just wondering if the patterns can be used in the CW. From what I see it can, but it will lose some quality? This is from the Gantry web site,

• Direct to 3D-capable lasers such as Epilog, Kern and many others.
• Generate CNC toolpaths using GrayGraphic images with CAD/CAM applications.

• The Gantry library of non-exclusive grayscale artwork is offered as an easy, cost effective
entry into the high value-added 3D laser carving marketplace.
• Two primary applications are directly to 3D laser carving capable laser engraving systems
and as input to g-code generators for CNC routers and mold and die fabrication.
• All image files feature 300 dpi lossless TIF format, 256 gray levels and 50-200% scalability.
• Personalizing and cutting vector options available on select images. Files shipped by e-mail.

Now I know the G-code will not work, it will with my K2 CNC. Maybe through Corel the TIF can be converted to GIF? Again I would think it would lose detail and quaility?

Maybe somebody can tell me if I am thinking correctly or as normal way off!

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

here you go. I just saved every one $125. your welcome.

[geekviking]

-------> :)

Too funny!

[dvel56]

What machine was used to carve the pattern?

[johnbryantjr]

i would say it was done with a laser Engraver (what do i know)
I should get one some day they are like 1,500 on ebay



What machine was used to carve the pattern?

[newcarver]

What I think it comes down to is the fact that some people are happy with scanning fridge magnets and converting clipart into usable patterns, and others prefer a bit more quality. Both are fine in the fact they make the user happy in the end. I have used both, as most of us probably have. The difference between scanned items and converted clipart as opposed to a modeled piece is clear. As stated earlier some of these patterns can take many many hours to create.
I commend all who post patterns as well as sell patterns, the more the better.

[mtylerfl]

...Maybe through Corel the TIF can be converted to GIF? Again I would think it would lose detail and quaility?

Maybe somebody can tell me if I am thinking correctly or as normal way off!

Ike

Hello Ike,

A tif can be converted to any common graphic file format you desire in any photo editing program, no problem. (You probably meant png, not gif, as your conversion, though). When greyscales, photos, and so on need to be kept at their highest quality - tif accomplishes that goal.

In fact, for practically all pro-quality bitmap graphics formats, a high-res tif is usually the filetype of choice that is sent between professional graphic artists. (For example, I submit photos of my projects to LHR as tif files for the printed packaging at Amazon, Lowes, etc.)

[JamesB]

Not specifically related to the topic but I thought I would post that we have a decent model of the US Seal in the Pattern Depot for $15

http://store.carvewright.com/product.php?productid=16588&cat=0&page=1

Cheers,
James

[Ike]

Hello Ike,

A tif can be converted to any common graphic file format you desire in any photo editing program, no problem. (You probably meant png, not gif, as your conversion, though). When greyscales, photos, and so on need to be kept at their highest quality - tif accomplishes that goal.

In fact, for practically all pro-quality bitmap graphics formats, a high-res tif is usually the filetype of choice that is sent between professional graphic artists. (For example, I submit photos of my projects to LHR as tif files for the printed packaging at Amazon, Lowes, etc.)


Thanks Michael for the info, but yes I did mean GIF. I know the TIF can't be converted to the ptn. Guess I worded it wrong! I am going with what I know with Corel I can save my patterns in GIF format then convert it into the ptn. format. From what i have gathered GIF is the best format available to use for CW.

That said, my question is,.... Would the Gantry patterns lose some or most of the detail by the need to convert the TIF format to any acceptable format the CW can use?

I say this from a CW owner, then it wouldn't make sense to buy the higher priced pattern if my above question is true. When Vector Art 3D has the same pattern for $15.00 and is proved to work in the CW.

I think that goes back to Kendall's question in the first place....

"i was just on another forum and was looking at projects and found this site that might be interesting. im not good at pattern making so maybe some of the more knowledgeable could check it out and give and opinion

the site is www.gantryco.com

i hope it works"

Ike

[www.go3d.us]

IKE grantyco.com is the reason why Thomas James started this thread so no need to post it again :)

Anyway, this maybe off topic but.....

It is true that tif image can be convert to any other type of image, same goes for other type of image can be converted to tif.
The file format is not an issue, the image quality is the main factor.
Tif image is best only if it originally generated by using graphic software, like photoshop for example or scanned image.
If you convert a .jpg image (taken by digital camera) to a .tif image you will have a larger file size thus the quality remain the same. Since it a .jpg to start with.
If you convert a tif image to a jpg image with 100% of compression level you will get a smaller file size and the quality remain the same.
A large size .jpg (4000x3000 dpi) can make a great 8x10 prints. That's is the reason why .jpg is incorporated in all digital camera today including those high end digital camera.

As for pattern making for CW machine .jpg and gif is the worse image to start with. jpg pixelated the image and gif has only 256 colors result in banding.
HLR using .png file format is because it's the only file format type that has full range of color and transparency background and it is universally available on all computer system without the need of a third party software codec or whatever.

[Ike]

IKE grantyco.com is the reason why Thomas James started this thread so no need to post it again :)

Anyway, this maybe off topic but.....

It is true that tif image can be convert to any other type of image, same goes for other type of image can be converted to tif.
The file format is not an issue, the image quality is the main factor.
Tif image is best only if it originally generated by using graphic software, like photoshop for example or scanned image.
If you convert a .jpg image (taken by digital camera) to a .tif image you will have a larger file size thus the quality remain the same. Since it a .jpg to start with.
If you convert a tif image to a jpg image with 100% of compression level you will get a smaller file size and the quality remain the same.
A large size .jpg (4000x3000 dpi) can make a great 8x10 prints. That's is the reason why .jpg is incorporated in all digital camera today including those high end digital camera.

As for pattern making for CW machine .jpg and gif is the worse image to start with. jpg pixelated the image and gif has only 256 colors result in banding.
HLR using .png file format is because it's the only file format type that has full range of color and transparency background and it is universally available on all computer system without the need of a third party software codec or whatever.
Thanks HT, but not arguing but Thomas James did not start the original post supershingler did! He was asking the members what we thought about the patterns and if they would work with the CW? I was wondering the same, again I say the patterns are awesome, but it was brought up the prices were a bit high for a hobbyist using the CW. Thomas concern was we didn't think the price was worth it. Which was not the point at all, we all agreed the patterns are great and well worth the price, but not for us poor CW users!

But being a dummy I was wondering if the the patterns could be converted into a format that is accepted by the designer. So I must be missing the answer? I have another CNC and never have used it so I don't understand the G-code concept. So one more try!!!

Ok, being said, the tif can be converted to any other format and unless I missed it the designer formats are bmp, jpg, jpeg, png, mng, gif, xpm . Png being the best choice to convert the tif, if a member didn't have Corel or photoshop. Would the Gantry patterns work with the CW? and if so would the carving come out as detailed and as high quality?

Sorry to say it again that was what supershinger asked who was the first member to share the Gantry patterns.......will they work?

Ike

PS I tried saving a pattern made in Corel draw as a png file and the designer would not except it. So now I really don't know?

[johnbryantjr]

GIMP can convert to png and its free
so you can load them



Thanks HT, but not arguing but Thomas James did not start the original post supershingler did! He was asking the members what we thought about the patterns and if they would work with the CW? I was wondering the same, again I say the patterns are awesome, but it was brought up the prices were a bit high for a hobbyist using the CW. Thomas concern was we didn't think the price was worth it. Which was not the point at all, we all agreed the patterns are great and well worth the price, but not for us poor CW users!

But being a dummy I was wondering if the the patterns could be converted into a format that is accepted by the designer. So I must be missing the answer? I have another CNC and never have used it so I don't understand the G-code concept. So one more try!!!

Ok, being said, the tif can be converted to any other format and unless I missed it the designer formats are bmp, jpg, jpeg, png, mng, gif, xpm . Png being the best choice to convert the tif, if a member didn't have Corel or photoshop. Would the Gantry patterns work with the CW? and if so would the carving come out as detailed and as high quality?

Sorry to say it again that was what supershinger asked who was the first member to share the Gantry patterns.......will they work?

Ike

[Ike]

I can convert to png format using Corel draw, but I was unable to import it into the designer. Is that what the gantry patterns are formatted in Gimp? I read it was a tif file.

Ok this is what the site states the formats are,

There are Two Distinct Applications for Gantry Graphics:

• Direct to 3D-capable lasers such as Epilog and many others.
• Generate CNC toolpaths using GrayGraphic images with CAD/CAM applications.

• The Gantry library of non-exclusive grayscale artwork is offered as an easy, cost effective
entry into the high value-added 3D laser carving marketplace.

• Two primary applications are directly to 3D laser carving capable laser engraving systems and as input to g-code generators for CNC routers and mold and die fabrication.

• All image files feature 300 dpi lossless TIF format, 256 gray levels and 50-200% scalability.

• Personalizing and cutting vector options available on select images. Files shipped by e-mail.

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

can you email me there test file so i can try it

john_3110@hotmail.com


I can convert to png format using Corel draw, but I was unable to import it into the designer. Is that what the gantry patterns are formatted in Gimp? I read it was a tif file.

Ok this is what the site states the formats are,

There are Two Distinct Applications for Gantry Graphics:

• Direct to 3D-capable lasers such as Epilog and many others.
• Generate CNC toolpaths using GrayGraphic images with CAD/CAM applications.

• The Gantry library of non-exclusive grayscale artwork is offered as an easy, cost effective
entry into the high value-added 3D laser carving marketplace.

• Two primary applications are directly to 3D laser carving capable laser engraving systems and as input to g-code generators for CNC routers and mold and die fabrication.

• All image files feature 300 dpi lossless TIF format, 256 gray levels and 50-200% scalability.

• Personalizing and cutting vector options available on select images. Files shipped by e-mail.

Ike

[Ike]

I am really trying to find out if they will work with the CW designer and not trying to sound like pain I would like to know how it will work and if it will carve the high quality as the patterns?

John I don't have a test file, as I said I tried converting a pattern to png and it would not load in the designer.

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

i have made pngs from other files and they work in designer. i emailed the company about the test file so if i get it i will see if it loads


I am really trying to find out if they will work with the CW designer and not trying to sound like pain I would like to know how it will work and if it will carve the high quality as the patterns?

John I don't have a test file, as I said I tried converting a pattern to png and it would not load in the designer.

Ike

[Ike]

i have made pngs from other files and they work in designer. i emailed the company about the test file so if i get it i will see if it loads

Thanks John, I wonder what I am doing wrong? In Corel Draw I can save the pattern into a png. It doesn't need to be a png in the first place? Is it because I converted to greyscale?

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

never used corel
but photoshop and gimp seem to work fine to make png from any file


Thanks John, I wonder what I am doing wrong? In Corel Draw I can save the pattern into a png. It doesn't need to be a png in the first place?

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

just tried this test file http://www-eng-x.llnl.gov/documents/a_image.tif
did save as in gimp to png worked fine for the cw software

[Ike]

Thanks John, Corel is an Adobe product, I have photo shop I will give it a try. I went to the link and it was a color strip. Is that the test?

ike

[johnbryantjr]

yeah thats it just the 1st thing that came up when i searched google for tif test file but if one works they all should


Thanks John, Corel is an Adobe product, I have photo shop I will give it a try. I went to the link and it was a color strip. Is that the test?

ike

[johnbryantjr]

lol i just saw this http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=109937 and http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f13/awesome-laser-engraved-humidor-9685/ seems like Thomas works for them

[Ike]

just tried this test file http://www-eng-x.llnl.gov/documents/a_image.tif
did save as in gimp to png worked fine for the cw software


lol i just saw this http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=109937 and http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f13/awesome-laser-engraved-humidor-9685/ seems like Thomas works for them
That is too funny! This has been an exciting topic! All started by one member wanting to share a pattern site he found and asked what we thought about them. The first response was wow high price! Then it turned into a debate on how you can make money from the patterns. Then it was stated we are hobbyist and never use our CW commercially ;)!

Then the same pattern the Nation Seal was brought up by another pattern maker he had for $15.00! I like the Gantry patterns and just wanted to know if they work with the CW designer and remain the high quality!

Oh what a headache....hmm $125.000 on one hand and $15.00 on the other for 2 really awesome same patterns. Which one would you choose?!

Ike

[ChrisAlb]

Who's going to try their free test graphic on the CW? :)

I'm going to Paul. I sent the email just a moment ago so it will be interesting to see what comes of it. No problem converting the TIF to PNG but it will be interesting to see how well the CW handles the fine details.

With respect to the site and their products, obviously they have some very fine work there and after spending many hours creating patterns, I can see them charging what they do. Whether one is inclined to pay such costs is of course a completely personal decision based on their needs, the level of quality the project demands and how much they could charge for the final product.

Case in point, there was a post talking about the Seal pattern at the depot for $15. A very nice pattern for $15 but to try and compare it to the Seal in the first post is well, in my humble opinion, ridiculous. Now, is it worth the price? Well, if I were carving a plaque for someone that I could get 50 or 60 bucks for probably not. But if I were carving a plaque for the White House? You betcha!!

I browsed their site and all the patterns there. They have some very nice ones for what "I consider" reasonable cost. They have what looks like a very nice horse there for $25. Assuming I could even make a horse like that it would take me many hours to do so. So what's worth more? My time to create the pattern or the sale of the final product? It's all relative.

[mtylerfl]

PS I tried saving a pattern made in Corel draw as a png file and the designer would not except it. So now I really don't know?

Hello Ike,

Maybe you already know this...

You can easily save a PNG from CorelDraw, but NOT using the "Save As" function. You use the EXPORT function. A dialog box will be available for you to choose a Transparent Background (use the Eye Dropper Tool to select "Image Color" to choose the color you want to be transparent).

The PNG from Corel will import to Designer just fine.

[Ike]

I'm going to Paul. I sent the email just a moment ago so it will be interesting to see what comes of it. No problem converting the TIF to PNG but it will be interesting to see how well the CW handles the fine details.

With respect to the site and their products, obviously they have some very fine work there and after spending many hours creating patterns, I can see them charging what they do. Whether one is inclined to pay such costs is of course a completely personal decision based on their needs, the level of quality the project demands and how much they could charge for the final product.

Case in point, there was a post talking about the Seal pattern at the depot for $15. A very nice pattern for $15 but to try and compare it to the Seal in the first post is well, in my humble opinion, ridiculous. Now, is it worth the price? Well, if I were carving a plaque for someone that I could get 50 or 60 bucks for probably not. But if I were carving a plaque for the White House? You betcha!!

I browsed their site and all the patterns there. They have some very nice ones for what "I consider" reasonable cost. They have what looks like a very nice horse there for $25. Assuming I could even make a horse like that it would take me many hours to do so. So what's worth more? My time to create the pattern or the sale of the final product? It's all relative.

Chris, I agree my point was as hobbyist carvers and even as a sign maker I bet the customer is going to choose the $15.00 pattern. I also agree the $125.00 pattern is well worth it and would recommend the higher quality pattern. I know what goes into making the patterns the cost of the software, the artist drawings etc. Just like my soda I charge $6.00 for a 32 oz. cup and some people don't realize why I need to charge $6.00! First the cup cost me $1.65 per cup, then tax is added in and at fairs a percentage of 20-25% so by the time I sell a cup I am lucky to make any money!

Thank you Chris for looking into it to see if the quality remains.

Again the Gantry patterns are awesome, yet the patterns Michael and HT and other makes are awesome too. It is great to have another site to choose from. I was concerned if they would convert and the quality remains. If not it wouldn't be worth it to buy.

Ike

[Ike]

Hello Ike,

Maybe you already know this...

You can easily save a PNG from CorelDraw, but NOT using the "Save As" function. You use the EXPORT function. A dialog box will be available for you to choose a Transparent Background (use the Eye Dropper Tool to select "Image Color" to choose the color you want to be transparent).

The PNG from Corel will import to Designer just fine.
Lol I am getting poster mixed up! No I didn't know that! I know some but not nearly all of Corel!

This is what I do to make my simple 2.5 D patterns,

First I import z pattern into Corel Draw convert the pattern to bitmap (grayscale) and then I will do a bitmap trace and add contour.

Then I will copy it and open from clipboard into Corel paint. I then mask the pattern, add Gaussian blur and then convert to 16 bit grayscale. But then it will not let me save it as png. So I remove the grayscale and then I am able to save as png. Yes this I did find out it will not allow me to open it in designer from file.

So I reopen the pattern in Paint and then copy and import it into designer using the clip board function.

Yes I did see the drop down box and I haven't paid attention to the background. I will give it a try, thank you!

Ike

[Ike]

Michael thank you so much! I did what you said, the drop down box was set at none for the transparent. So I used the masked area changed it to white and save the file. Opened the designer imported the png file no problem! Thank you!

Here is the pattern nothing special, but it is png! Well from a png it is a ptn now!

I was messing around and made some improvements on the skull, with adjustments in the designer it not too bad!

Ike

[badger]

You can all take this whatever way you wish. I do this as stress release being a cop. I try and give what people have looked for. I think as myself as only an amatuer but really dont care since I have fun doing it.

What anyone would want to pay for something is truely up to them and no one should tell them it is too much or they can get it cheaper else where. What it means to them is a personal feeling.

I also beleive that this machine is for hobbyist only and some that do make money from it good job to you. I also beleive if you think your carving on something is worth alot of money you really need to start considering what have you really done to earn that. Im not talking about a project where you build something because you do earn whatever praise you get from building it. But truely how hard is it to put a pattern on a card and press start.

We have become a lazy nation that has looked only at how fast can it be done and how cheap for me.

I just read an article that really hit it on the mark. My hats have always gone off to those that can do true art by hand without the need for a computer and I do beleive it is a dyig breed of people that still have that talent.

The State of Woodcarving in America Today by Maura Macaluso (a free ebook)

You can read it here: http://www.carvinginnyc.com/state%20of%20woodcarving.htm

It is a long read but I felt was worth it. My favorite was in the conclusion:

What do boomers spend their money on? Nice shiny new tools, Gadgets, Books, DVDS, and patterns, anything that will make carving easier for them. Some of them are not interested in learning real technique.

You can visit her website : http://www.carvinginnyc.com/index.html
and I did get her permission to use these links.


What Im trying to say is art is in the eye of the beholder. I think that the work done here is nice work done by all and if someone wants to spend $125.00 instead of $15.00 they have their reasons and shouldnt be double guessed by anyone.

I for one would love to take some classes in hand carving and try it to make a couple pieces for myself. I do think the art has been lost and being a boomer myself I beleive in the statement above by Maura but I also beleive in those that use the machines to kick out carvings to be used in projects of their own.


Again I wouldnt worry about what person is charging whatever price, its a nice link for those that want to use it and test it on their own and I see no problem with it.

[LittleRedWoodshop]

First of all, I have been following this thread waiting for something worth commenting on. First, thank you for the Ebook, I will be sure to read it. Second, I applaud you. So, many others things that I could say but I will refrain.

[Ike]

Badger, well said! But being a sign maker and finding offering the best materials like the best redwood and and finishes, plus I hand route most of my signs means nothing to most customers. So rather it is hand carved or hand routed or CNC made most customers either don't care or knows the difference! It is very frustrating having the average customer come to your shop at a fair with a full beer with 4 empty cups stack beneath the full one. That they paid up to $6.00 per beer and tell me my sign 6" X 24" for $30.00 is too expensive! A sign that with proper care will last a long time, yet those beers are soon to just ...... well you know! That is why I switched business' to old fashioned soda!

Being hurt and needing to retire from the same line of work you are in I know the stress! But in every job there is stress, the same goes with the sign business. Trust me 8 out of 10 people will choose the $15.00 pattern over the $125.00 pattern. The problem is not knowing for sure if the $125.00 pattern will give the desired results with the CW.

When I know a customer is on a budget I try to accommodate them. On the other hand if the customer wants the best in everything the $125.00 pattern is what I would use, providing it will carve well in the CW.

Yes that is life the world we live in, I do it at times as I am sure you do too! When we buy gas we look for the cheapest price. Same goes for food, clothes, lumber etc. Somethings no, I spent over $30,000 to restore my 67 Firebird that my wife's parents bought brand new. We asked for the best parts and chose the best shop!

Again I am not putting Gantry patterns down in anyway because of the price or anything else. I am glad we have the option for a more detailed pattern. as I said before I have another CNC and these patterns will work great!

Ike

[johnbryantjr]

ok here is there test file
I am kind of mixed on it. it looks good but i do not think it would be worth the price

[Ike]

ok here is there test file
I am kind of mixed on it. it looks good but i do not think it would be worth the price

John, thanks for posting the test. I did some adjusting on height and draft etc. It is more detailed then I thought it would be, but I agree it doesn't look like it will carve well with the CW.

I think the patterns in the pattern depot are well detailed!

Ike

[mtylerfl]

Actually, I think it would do pretty well at that size, but until someone really carves it, no one will know for sure.;)

The only things you might want to do is set the Bit Optimization to BEST (always a good idea anyway when using high-quality patterns) and set the depth to .187" (3/16") and height to 999. Those settings for this particular pattern should yield a good result.

Of course, avoid Red Oak or any other very open-grained wood because of chip-out risk. White oak MIGHT be ok - Select Pine or most tight-grained hardwoods should do well for high detail carves such as this.

[HighTechOkie]

Here it is in poplar. It is about 10" wide 8.5" tall. Depth 0.187" Height 999, Quality Best and a quick once over with a sanding mop. Carve time was 1:10. Optimal was estimated at 2:40.

Overall I would say it came out pretty decent considering the poor wood choice. I'm not sure how well it would carve in a smaller size.

I think if someone is considering purchasing patterns from gantry, they should go the pattern partner route. At $39 it is definitely worth it to me. At $125, not so much.

Rob

[Ike]

Here it is in poplar. It is about 10" wide 8.5" tall. Depth 0.187" Height 999, Quality Best and a quick once over with a sanding mop. Carve time was 1:10. Optimal was estimated at 2:40.

Overall I would say it came out pretty decent considering the poor wood choice. I'm not sure how well it would carve in a smaller size.

I think if someone is considering purchasing patterns from gantry, they should go the pattern partner route. At $39 it is definitely worth it to me. At $125, not so much.

Rob
Thanks Rob for carving it! I did mess with it and smaller size it looked better in the designer. Still great patterns, but my opinion wrong machine. When I set up my K2 I will give the pattern a try!

Ike

[5twenty]

It sounds like I'm in the minority here but I wish there were more sources for these high quality 3d graphics. When I buy a computer I know that you have to spend just as much to buy the software that goes on the computer. So when I bought my CC I presumed I would be spending a fair amount for quality graphics and have budgeted for that. It doesn't make much sense to me to buy a $2000 machine then not use it to it's full potential because of a lack of a high quality $150 pattern.

Does anyone have more sources for these high quality graphics other that the Carvewright store? Gantry is a good start but I'm looking for more of the super high quality stuff that can be found there.

I once found a site that had tons of very high quality 3d grayscale height mapped images that were available in STL format, now I can't find it again. Anyone know that site I'm thinking of?

[Ike]

It sounds like I'm in the minority here but I wish there were more sources for these high quality 3d graphics. When I buy a computer I know that you have to spend just as much to buy the software that goes on the computer. So when I bought my CC I presumed I would be spending a fair amount for quality graphics and have budgeted for that. It doesn't make much sense to me to buy a $2000 machine then not use it to it's full potential because of a lack of a high quality $150 pattern.

Does anyone have more sources for these high quality graphics other that the Carvewright store? Gantry is a good start but I'm looking for more of the super high quality stuff that can be found there.

I once found a site that had tons of very high quality 3d grayscale height mapped images that were available in STL format, now I can't find it again. Anyone know that site I'm thinking of?

Vector Art 3D has stl patterns and high quality.

Ike

[www.go3d.us]

It sounds like I'm in the minority here but I wish there were more sources for these high quality 3d graphics. When I buy a computer I know that you have to spend just as much to buy the software that goes on the computer. So when I bought my CC I presumed I would be spending a fair amount for quality graphics and have budgeted for that. It doesn't make much sense to me to buy a $2000 machine then not use it to it's full potential because of a lack of a high quality $150 pattern.

Does anyone have more sources for these high quality graphics other that the Carvewright store? Gantry is a good start but I'm looking for more of the super high quality stuff that can be found there.

I once found a site that had tons of very high quality 3d grayscale height mapped images that were available in STL format, now I can't find it again. Anyone know that site I'm thinking of?

5twenty, have you checked out my site yet? www.go3d.us

[Ike]

5twenty, have you checked out my site yet? www.go3d.us
Oh shoot sorry HT I forgot you offer stl patterns too! Yes another great source!

Ike